Drugs in our drinking water

[ravenscape]

(AP) -- A vast array of pharmaceuticals -- including antibiotics, anti-convulsants, mood stabilizers and sex hormones -- have been found in the drinking water supplies of at least 41 million Americans, an Associated Press investigation shows.

Officials in Philadelphia say testing there discovered 56 pharmaceuticals or byproducts in treated drinking water.

To be sure, the concentrations of these pharmaceuticals are tiny, measured in quantities of parts per billion or trillion, far below the levels of a medical dose. Also, utilities insist their water is safe.
But the presence of so many prescription drugs -- and over-the-counter medicines like acetaminophen and ibuprofen -- in so much of our drinking water is heightening worries among scientists of long-term consequences to human health.


http://www.cnn.com/2008/HEALTH/03/10/pharma.water1.ap/?iref=hpmostpop

On the one hand, the concentrations make homeopathic preparations look like concentrates. On the other hand, effects on wildlife (particularly aquatic and sentinal species) have been documented, as have effects on human cells in the laboratory.

[Matty]

I'll take a longer look at that but i do wonder how much significance they bear compared to say fertilizer run-off and hormone such by organo-phosphates and the like.
My gut tells me that the effect of these superdilute drug will be invisible against that sort of background yet maybe not in accumulated doses ofer a long time of course. i'll have a better look when i get chance.

Interesting stuff though. and a very useful excuse for those Philly guys with man boobs. :)

[Oolon Colluphid]

My gut tells me that the effect of these superdilute drug will be invisible against that sort of background yet maybe not in accumulated doses ofer a long time of course. i'll have a better look when i get chance.
I just hope the homeopaths aren't right!

[Matty]

heh, at least they know the active ingredient existed in this run off in the first place, and was a compound that was actually active in some way. Thats more than you ever get in a homoeopathic set-up.

If we are talking about compounds with accumulator effects ten the length of exposure and concentration are all relative right. Like i said it smells of tabloid silliness to me but i guess it depends on the drugs they are focussing on.

[Matty]

ok with a closer look they admit the actual effects are far from ascertained but that the drugs are in detectable concentrations in most drinking water (and so a lot more concerntrated than homeopathy, which uses dilutions so low that there typically wouldnt be an atom of active ingredient in a gallon of the diluent ) , and that is a "cause for concern".

Usual press release stuff in other words.

one aspect that made me pay attention was that some of these low level drugs could trigger a cascade reaction, the one they mentioned was inflammatory responses in some blood cells, now whilst that might not be the end of the world as an example, it does hint that reactions in which the inital push is all that is particularly needed, could be triggered by such low levels of pharmaceutical.

implications for pregnant women and developing embryos, wher hormonal control is highly important, could also be worth checking i guess.

[Loren Pechtel]

http://www.cnn.com/2008/HEALTH/03/10/pharma.water1.ap/?iref=hpmostpop

On the one hand, the concentrations make homeopathic preparations look like concentrates. On the other hand, effects on wildlife (particularly aquatic and sentinal species) have been documented, as have effects on human cells in the laboratory.

A nuclear plant in Arizona? had a bit of a problem with them. They were using treated sewage for cooling water--and had to get an exception from the NRC because their water was *WAY* too hot--from the radioiodine thyroid patients had pissed out.

[Garnet]

Huh? When was that, Loren?

[Loren Pechtel]

Huh? When was that, Loren?

I have no idea on when--what I read about it didn't say anything about when.


The book also had another interesting tidbit: A guy who was very critical of nuclear power. He was at some presentation at a nuclear power plant--and set off the alarms on the way out.

Some checking and they conclude that he's not contaminated, it's just he was wearing an antique watch--with a radium dial. That did a pretty good job of shutting him up!

[Garnet]

I lived in Phoenix for most of my life so if you can ever find out when that occurred, I'd be interested. I kind of wonder if my pee ever glowed in the dark. You see, we just thought the water tasted funny because it had too much chlorine in it. ;)

[Quizalufagus]

implications for pregnant women and developing embryos, wher hormonal control is highly important, could also be worth checking i guess.

Also, low doses of some psychoactive drugs may have the potential to cause problems in the development of a fetus' nervous system. At some stages of development it's pretty easy to mess up the brain, so that may also be worth checking.

[Matty]

true.

[pSimon]

I have no idea on when--what I read about it didn't say anything about when.


The book also had another interesting tidbit: A guy who was very critical of nuclear power. He was at some presentation at a nuclear power plant--and set off the alarms on the way out.

Some checking and they conclude that he's not contaminated, it's just he was wearing an antique watch--with a radium dial. That did a pretty good job of shutting him up!

I have an anecdote like that too. (Not sure if it's true, but I was working at a Nuclear Power Station at the time)

A guy set the the alarms off going in. Turns out he had contaminated paint on his overalls. He'd nicked a brush from inside the place, and been painting his front room with it....

Not that the levels were anything like high in most places there.

[Loren Pechtel]

I have an anecdote like that too. (Not sure if it's true, but I was working at a Nuclear Power Station at the time)

A guy set the the alarms off going in. Turns out he had contaminated paint on his overalls. He'd nicked a brush from inside the place, and been painting his front room with it....

Not that the levels were anything like high in most places there.

This doesn't make much sense--that would have to have been a pretty hot brush to start with and why would a paintbrush get hot like that?

[pSimon]

The detectors are pretty damn sensitive; I don't think much contamination would be required.

Why would the brush get hot? They paint the walls with emulsion paint inside. Dust transfers that way. (Lots of the contamination at these place is in the dust, ro so I was told).

Having said that, I've no verification for it, and these sorts of stories tend to grow in the telling. (Just a bit!)


Here's something I can verify: part of the "Anti-radiation" equipment I was issued with was a standard set of yellow Marigold gloves (washing-up for the use of), to prevent contact with said contaminated dust.

Perfectly effective, of course, but hard to take seriously, then or since...

:)

[Loren Pechtel]

The detectors are pretty damn sensitive; I don't think much contamination would be required.

It would have to be pretty hot to transfer enough to the paint that some painting splatter would set it off. That's quite a bit of dilution.

And how did they get the brush out without setting off the alarms?

Why would the brush get hot? They paint the walls with emulsion paint inside. Dust transfers that way. (Lots of the contamination at these place is in the dust, ro so I was told).

Where would they be painting in a hot area?

Here's something I can verify: part of the "Anti-radiation" equipment I was issued with was a standard set of yellow Marigold gloves (washing-up for the use of), to prevent contact with said contaminated dust.

Perfectly effective, of course, but hard to take seriously, then or since...

:)

Yeah, gloves will stop alpha and beta, nothing you can carry will stop gamma or neutron. The real thing is a barrier to prevent getting it on you, they would suffice.

[pSimon]

It would have to be pretty hot to transfer enough to the paint that some painting splatter would set it off. That's quite a bit of dilution.

And how did they get the brush out without setting off the alarms?



Good question. You could probably get stuff out in a toolbox, though. Having said that they were pretty damn paranoid when I worked there about anything you took out.

Like I said, I don't totally buy it. Most industrial sites seem to have some "stories" of this kind. Not too easy to check veracity.



Where would they be painting in a hot area?



Level 2 (I think - it's been a while now) areas certainly did have paint. lots of metal work, handrails and that sort of stuff.

Just for reference, I was working on the crane system that services the pilecap at the time.

I never went anywhere "hotter" than that, I'm happy to say.


Yeah, gloves will stop alpha and beta, nothing you can carry will stop gamma or neutron. The real thing is a barrier to prevent getting it on you, they would suffice.

They're also are a real pain in the arse to work in if you have to type, or put wires in terminals! Not improved by the temperature being about 45C.

[Ray Moscow]

Drugs in our drinking water


So far, no one seems too concerned about drinking other people's urine. :)

[BWE]

I remember reading about a similar thing in science news a while back but looking for illegal drugs in the city's sewer. It worked. I was amazed about the LSD. I can't find it here though so it isn't the most recent 3 or 4 issues.

[clivedurdle]

Is not this very old news? Friends of the Earth was campaigning about it in the 70's and 80's - contraceptive pills were a concern.

[Berthold]

So far, no one seems too concerned about drinking other people's urine. :)
Some drink their own. :p

No, I don't mean inadvertently, like a certain guy back then at IIDB! :D