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Messages - Faid

51
How do you know it's "new"?

And how do you know it's a different process?
it's new in the sense that almost no one in the mainstream is talking about it.
And you know that from your extensive review of the relevant bibliography?

Quote
And it's not a different process once it comes out of the protozoa's ass.
And that process is...
52
How do you know it's "new"?

And how do you know it's a different process?
53
I had hoped that this would be an interesting discussion about how micro-organisms Supply plants with nutrients. It's really interesting stuff.
Lol. That is LITERALLY the thing I'm asking you.
Quote
But instead it was yet another study in human psychology.
Most of your posts are.
54
Just forget it. You people obviously aren't interested in learning anything about holistic management or microorganisms in the soil or anything other than what you learned at University. You are happy with your slogans like "don't cut trees down in rainforest" and that's the end of it.
Not University. Highschool. Our brainwashing started early on, see.

For example- Do you know the official Prty line on "How Do Plant Root Work"?
55
"The point that you don't seem to grasp is that the portion in the free form is continuously subject to rapid leaching."

No I grasped that point a long time ago. You are the one that is not grasping my point, my point being that I don't freaking care about these free form minerals. What I care about is microorganisms. How many different ways do I need to say this before you will get it?
No one cares about what you care about. Some care to clarify your understanding of said issues. But you don't seem to care about that either.

Again, how do those "salts" go from the inside of microorganisms to plant roots? Care to elaborate on your previous "guess"?
Again, I'm just starting to learn the specifics of this and the only one I can give you any sort of an answer for would-be protozoa. It is my understanding that protozoa eat bacteria and poop out excess nitrogen in the form of some sort of salt. Maybe salt isn't the right word I forget. Whatever Elaine Ingham said on the video. Or was it Patricia Richardson. I don't remember for sure but it doesn't matter. The point is that these protozoa poop out a form of nitrogen that the plants can use. The obvious question then is the obvious question then is why wouldn't this get washed away in a big rain and I think the answer must be that they are pooping it directly on the root hairs and it is getting absorbed almost immediately.

But I'm not sure if anyone here cares about this interesting scientific stuff. It seems that most people here are only interested in mindlessly chanting slogans such as ....

"Dave is an idiot"

"Cutting rainforest is bad"

And so on.
That is not an answer.

The question is, HOW do plants "use" that form?

Or is that not "interesting scientific stuff"?
56
The sooner you realize that most scientists with Advanced degrees working in the life sciences are hurting rather than helping the progress of agriculture, the better off you will be.
Poor dave.
57
Here's why you guys are having so much trouble with all of this.

Pretty much everything you learned in school and in college about agriculture is either wrong or fucked up.

Just flush everything you learned down the commode and start fresh. Wipe the dry erase board completely clean and start over.
Problem is, because you didn't learn a single thing about agriculture in school and in college, you have no idea what others learned. You just assume they are as ignorant as you- or, worse, "brainwashed by the fertilizer establishment"(lol).

Prove me wrong. What did you learn in highschool about how roots work?
58
"The point that you don't seem to grasp is that the portion in the free form is continuously subject to rapid leaching."

No I grasped that point a long time ago. You are the one that is not grasping my point, my point being that I don't freaking care about these free form minerals. What I care about is microorganisms. How many different ways do I need to say this before you will get it?
No one cares about what you care about. Some care to clarify your understanding of said issues. But you don't seem to care about that either.

Again, how do those "salts" go from the inside of microorganisms to plant roots? Care to elaborate on your previous "guess"?
59
I've been talking about commercial fertilizer a lot because people keep talking about nutrients leaching out of the soil and the only context in which that kind of talk makes any sense is within the context of industrial farming using commercial fertilizers.
I for one have not accepted your claims about nitrogen and phosphorus, for lack of evidence provided.

But don't forget...

Potassium
Sulfur
Magnesium
Calcium
Iron
Boron
Manganese
Zinc
Molybdenum
Copper

All of which have very different chemical properties.

Why do you think these won't leach?
because they are inside the bodies of soil organisms you idiot.
And how do plants aquire those?
best I can tell it's microorganisms taking a shit on root hairs

Mind you, this microorganism stuff is new to me too.
See, now I can't figure out whether or not you're joking.
60
I've been talking about commercial fertilizer a lot because people keep talking about nutrients leaching out of the soil and the only context in which that kind of talk makes any sense is within the context of industrial farming using commercial fertilizers.
I for one have not accepted your claims about nitrogen and phosphorus, for lack of evidence provided.

But don't forget...

Potassium
Sulfur
Magnesium
Calcium
Iron
Boron
Manganese
Zinc
Molybdenum
Copper

All of which have very different chemical properties.

Why do you think these won't leach?
because they are inside the bodies of soil organisms you idiot.
And how do plants aquire those?
61
it's just that every so often my head explodes from the ineptness.
You people seem to be nothing but zombies chanting "cutting down rainforests is bad .... cutting down rainforests is bad"
Two memescape-worthy statements in one post!  :clap:
62
The whole fucking enchilada with HMG is to mimic Nature's designs, a great example of which is found in the rainforest.

Why the fuck do you think HMG ranchers don't have to apply bagged fertilizers to make their pastures super productive, so productive that they can support two and three times the conventional stocking rates?

It's because they are following Nature's designs, a great example of which can be found in the rainforest.

Good Lord, you people are so brainwashed it's pathetic!
Nature's design for rainforests is for them to be forest, Dave, not pasture. Cutting down the trees to convert rainforest to pasture is not in any way mimicking nature's design.
it is really mind-blowing that you guys cannot connect the dots with this stuff. I guess it comes down to the brainwashing. The fertilizer sales establishment must be extremely powerful indeed.
Because the fertilizer sales establishment is all about preserving pristine rainforests, donchaknow.

It's all a mess inside your head, dave.
63
Notice that borealis pointed out that the two are different, as you now agree. But you originally made the difference to be all about talking about something and actually doing it. Except it was not about the same thing.

I mean comeon.
64
Well, no.
I just think there is too much negativity being attached to everything that Trump does.

Previous presidents, from Bush to Clinton and Obama, have promised to move the US Embassy to Jerusalem, but never kept those promises. Trump kept his promise, and the liberals attack him for it.

Obama did use military bases to house illegal children immigrants. Trump just talks about doing it, and the headlines scream that he is a monster.
I am beginning to see liberals as the most dishonest people on the planet.

65
Yes, it's clearly two different things. Housing unaccompanied children, as opposed to talking about separating children from their families "as a deterrent".

So why the comparison?
66
The whole fucking enchilada with HMG is to mimic Nature's designs, a great example of which is found in the rainforest.

Why the fuck do you think HMG ranchers don't have to apply bagged fertilizers to make their pastures super productive, so productive that they can support two and three times the conventional stocking rates?

It's because they are following Nature's designs, a great example of which can be found in the rainforest.

Good Lord, you people are so brainwashed it's pathetic!
Nature's design for rainforests is for them to be forest, Dave, not pasture. Cutting down the trees to convert rainforest to pasture is not in any way mimicking nature's design.
What, you mean you haven't seen the famous Stripeforests of Davelandia? With the all-natural occuring 330ft-wide strips of grassland between the trees? Strips where large herbivores bunch and graze, only to move down the length of the strip when jaguars jump at them from the wood? Nature's Design at its finest!
67
Politics and Current Events / Re: Israel
Quote
applying double standards by requiring of it a behavior not expected or demanded of any other democratic nation;
Heh. So, anytime someone accuses the state of Israel on failings in their behavior, they should follow it with a clause like:

"Israel should not gun down and kill unarmed protesters and even medical personnel!*"

(*) It should be noted that the author holds that a similar behavior should be expected and demanded by all democratic nations, listed as of 2017 in the link below (#1 to #76): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy_Index#Democracy_Index_by_country_(2017)"
68
Dave, you are know for a handful of things, but honesty is not one of them.
Go fuck yourself, liar. I'm the most honest person here.  Always have been.  Always will be.  You're the loser because you believe the lies about me.  Plus a myriad of other lies about Nature.
Being honest involes more than saying you are,  and falsely accusing people of things, Dave. 
You have falsely accused me and others of being everything from liars to being child molesters.  That alone is a knock at your honesty.
No I haven't. You are lying.
No he isn't. You have essentially said that I might be a child molester, and then you tried to downplay it by saying you had merely "raised the possibility" (!!!) of me being a child molester. Also, you called at least two people here "baby killers" (and your justification for that was even more absurd, if that's even possible).

Scripta manent, dave.
69
Dave, you are know for a handful of things, but honesty is not one of them.
Go fuck yourself, liar. I'm the most honest person here.  Always have been.  Always will be.
That's great!

So, like any HONEST person would do, I'm sure you'll properly redo the payment to NCSE. Since the check didn't clear when you first tried, and you still owe them that money (as per the terms of the bet).

Right, HONEST Dave?
70
Hawkiins's dropping F-bombs is another one of his obvious tells.

You got caught in a lie, dave.
Elaine Ingham did not say that soil organisms were the only factor affecting soil acidity.
Did I?

How much are you willing to bet?  $1000?
I'm willing to bet $1000!

Just keep in mind that, in case I lose, there's a big chance the check will be lost in the mail. You know how these things are, right? Sure you do. So I'll just post a picture of the check and I'll consider my obligation settled. I'm sure you understand.
71
How are those minerals absorbed by the plants?
72
You are just regurgitating what you have read about all the nutrients being in the canopy. And of course that is somewhat true because rainforest trees are so massive. But I doubt any octohatters have really done a serious analysis of how much NPK and trace minerals are in the rainforest soil because all these nutrients are bound up not only in Roots but also in the bodies of organisms and octohatters aren't used to thinking of nutrients being inside  the bodies of organisms like bacteria and fungi.

 It's a whole different way of thinking.
Very interesting if true. Dave, by what processes do trees access "nutrients being inside the bodies of organisms like bacteria and fungi" and have such processes been observed? What are the (observed?) mechanisms by which microorganism are able to incorporate nutrients (which of course have to be in a solution) before tree roots absorb them directly?
I really don't know very much about it yet because there are so few scientists working in this field because of course you cannot sell nutrients like this in a bag.  One thing I do know is that according to dr. Patricia Richardson, protozoa in the soil eat bacteria and they poop out the perfect form of nitrogen for plants to be able to absorb.
Which is soluble. Because if it wasn't they couldn't absorb it.
Don't be silly.  You don't know that, because dave doesn't know that, and it is inconceivable that others might know anything that Brilliant Dave doesn't know. That's how he knows that scientists have not studied the way plants absorb nutrients: Dave has no clue, therefore octohatters have no clue. Ergo, :itsamystery: that octohatters do not care to solve, because they famously never study plants and their roots- they study bags of chemicals. Any other questions?
73
Fun biochemical fact:
Minerals have to be in soluble form for plant roots to absorb them.
I'm still a bit new to the topic, but believe that this is incorrect.
So how do roots absorb "bacteria, fungi and other microscopic 'livestock'"?
74
And for Voxrat ...

Multiple choice ...

Rainforest plants (like all plants) require NPK plus many other trace minerals.  What form do we find it in? (In rain forest soils)

A) Water soluble minerals?
B)  In bacteria, fungi and other microscopic "livestock"?
How is cutting down rainforest trees and the symbiotic fungi that help with nutrient uptake, going to improve the soil in a massively rainy environment?

He thinks grass is sufficient to replace the enormous quantity of biomass represented by rainforest foliage etc.

He thinks rainforest micro-organisms will process grass exactly as they process rainforest foliage.

He still thinks poop is magic. In fact he's a bit fixated on feces in general.
Dave doesn't really grasp the concept of scale. Remember, he thought that, if a slice of fudge cake can stand on the plate and not sludge, then a mile-high vertical wall of sediment with the same density can do the same.