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  • Talk Rational: we stand with daap-umop-bup

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11
From my perspective,  she's engaged pretty honestly and modified her positions when she's discovered discrepancies.  That's actually more than I can say for lots of people. We arrive at our positions by assembling and synthesizing our experiences including the information we encounter along the way. When those positions don't change with further experiences it's a reasonable hypothesis that the individual that doesn't modify their position is stuck in an ideological bubble and is unlikely to be particularly useful in real world community problem solving.

Not pointing any fingers or expressing support for any position put forward here, but I'm not sure why the meme of Pandora being a bot or a horrible person is as quickly referenced as it is. Her past positions seem to be substantially modified to me.
12
how can it be fiction when Pandora is deffo a replicant
13
If they are not, then please explain to me at what point they BECOME babies ... when they exit the birth canal? When the cord is cut?  How about preemies? Are THEY fetuses? Not babies?

Try the traditional Jewish view: personhood is acquired on the first breath. Compare Gen 1:7, "And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul."

Do you recognize the Bible as some kind of authority? For an example of when a foetus isn't considered a person, read Gen 38:24, "And it came to pass about three months after, that it was told Judah, saying, Tamar thy daughter in law hath played the harlot; and also, behold, she is with child by whoredom. And Judah said, Bring her forth, and let her be burnt." Not yet a person, no prospective infanticide.

Even better, Ex 21:22, "If men strive, and hurt a woman with child, so that her fruit depart from her, and yet no mischief follow: he shall be surely punished, according as the woman's husband will lay upon him; and he shall pay as the judges determine." "With child", that is rather "with a potential child", but no transgression of the thou shalt not kill/murder thing; the foetus is just a piece of property belonging to the man. Interesting turn of phrase "and yet no mischief follow" ....

If you have read the Bible, you should also have noticed the recipe for bringing on an abortion to an unfaithful wife. No problem getting rid of the growth. No arguing that the priest is allowed to murder.

14
What Dave is really asking, of course, is why we (or some of us) do not regard unborn fetuses as babies in the legal sense of being a person.

It's a decent question, given that we do in fact refer to "unborn babies" in many contexts, including when we are pregnant.

I'm happy to give my answer to that question.


OK I'm listening.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)
15
but if there's a notion here that people are entitled to work in the particular industry they know and like, even if it requires large and sustained public intervention to prop up, I see problems with that. 
If a person can't get a job that covers their expenses in the place they live... shouldn't they move?  If the jobs available to them don't meet their income requirements... shouldn't they retrain?

If people live in an rural setting, and it is unsustainable, we seem perfectly willing to insist that the rural dwellers should move to urban settings, retrain to a completely new field, and completely uproot their lives.  If people live in an urban setting, and it is unsustainable, we seem perfectly willing to increase minimum wage, provide housing and food assistance, subsidize their transportation, and make sure they aren't forced to uproot their lives.

Why are urban poor better and more deserving of support and assistance than rural poor?

The urban poor are cast as victims.  They are stuck in a cycle of poverty that is intergenerational with long-lasting effects.  They can't break out of that cycle themselves - they need our help!  It's not their fault!

The rural poor are cast as villains.  They're determined to make bad decisions fueled by their ignorance and their hick ways.  They don't have the hutzpah to just move to a better place.  They don't deserve our help.  They're responsible for their decisions.
Just a quick heads up. GOP propaganda isn't true, and Blade Runner is fiction.
16
What Dave is really asking, of course, is why we (or some of us) do not regard unborn fetuses as babies in the legal sense of being a person.

It's a decent question, given that we do in fact refer to "unborn babies" in many contexts, including when we are pregnant.

I'm happy to give my answer to that question.


OK I'm listening.
17
This just in, City Government's spend their money on City services.
And State Governments spend their money on Urban services.

So... the lower income cities and counties take in lower amounts in local revenues... and they receive lower allotments of state-level revenues. 

It's almost as if in-State spending is proportional to population density!!!

Our state is always trying to attract businesses just as any other state, when we do get a big manufacturer or corporation, where do you think that company chooses to locate to and why?
18
Science / Re: Deextinction and Rewilding
Last post by Cephus0 -
Part of the problem is the American government won't fund weather satellites that were already built, because... reasons?

I don't agree with that.  I want to see quality data being generated and in that way perhaps even advance the science.
19
Lol

EDIT: Actually that's a pretty weird comparison. I've never even heard of anyone "raping" a baby.  Aborting, yes. But never raping.
Sadly you need only Google a little to find that yes, babies are sometimes raped.

Peez
My link is in the other thread.
20
yeah again, I don't doubt that this is real. But it's certainly interesting that somehow this information was being distributed by alt-right Trumpists before the storybroke.