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Messages - RAFH

1
OK Pingu I have a question for you ... I want to see if I understand your view about the causes of dental caries. Consider again the two swiss groups that price studied.  We'll abbreviate them to LV and SM.  The caries rate in LV was 3.4% but it was 29.8% in SM.  I think I understand your view to be that the reason for the higher rate in SM was because they ate some sugar and refined carbohydrates, whereas in LV today they probably did not eat refined sugar and probably not  bread made with white flour and so forth but they did eat whole-grain breads and possibly got some sweets via fruits and/or honey.  they may have had other sweets too, we don't know. I do know that the Wai Wai people that my dad worked with raised sugarcane and it was very sweet.  I cannot imagine LV children going completely without sweets.

 anyway, what is your view on this?

Why don't you go back to my response to you on this?

Price thought that bacterial acid, like the Poor, Are Always With Us.  And so variation in dental caries must be due to differences in susceptibility to its effects.

And so he thought that the association that he observed between refined sugar and flour and dental caries (a very real association) was due to the nutrients removed from these high calorie foods, and thus not being there to protect against the acid.

However, what he does not mention (presumably because he was not aware of it - he certainly did not measure it) is the local effects of sugar IN THE MOUTH on pH.

And so an equally good fit to his data is that the reason the candy-eating children had more caries is not because they were less resistant to the effects of acid, but that their candy-eating caused steeper, deeper drops in pH.

And that's what later research showed.  Yes, poor nutrition can make you more vulnerable to the effects of low pH.  But even with good nutrition, low pH will still tend to cause dental caries.  And even with poor nutrition, without foods that lower the pH, caries is rare (as with children in famines).

One exception is that fluoride really has reduced the association between sugar consumption and dental caries.  But fluoride wasn't something that Price was interested in, or indeed aware of. And of course the WAPF are dead set against fluoride.
But you keep ignoring the fact that these indigenous groups ate starchy and sweet foods  and they NEVER brushed their teeth so it's quite certain that plenty of their children went to bed after sucking on a piece of sugar cane  or sweet fruit and did not rinse before going to sleep.  do you doubt this for some reason?
Yes I do, for no other reason than you are simply speculating about something you know nothing about, so your point is based on nothing. Do you really believe the children of LV were sucking on sugar cane or sweet fruit? What evidence do you have to support that claim? I'd note many indigenous peoples did not have access to sugar cane. Did the Maasai? Or many of the Pacific Islanders?
Back up your claims before you suggest others support they doubts about them.
2
Politics and Current Events / Re: Trumpocalypse
Trump is more of a rocket man than a climatologist.
Can his test flight be one out of the solar -planetary plane?
3
Politics and Current Events / Re: Trumpocalypse
"shift NASA's resources" sounds like they want to cut science to pay for it.  manned spaceflight is great.  as long as it isn't taking money away from science.

guessing the first thing to go will be the lying climatologists.
Somebody has to test those rockets.
4
Not lying. Just operating under an incorrect paradigm.
Wrong thread.
This goes in the "Self-Righteous Man" thread.
It should be in the preamble to every Bluffy thread.
6
Pingu,  one day, when you have a moment, Google the word "lobotomy reversal."
Won't help in your case Bluffy, besides, despite her many accomplishments, I doubt Pingu is ready to take on brain surgery,.
7
No. of health problems "fixed" - 0
No. of people fed - 0
Area of degraded land reversed - 0

Top hit rate you got there.


Bluffy's got a perfect score!
8
So Dave, tell us why you think it is "very good science".

What are the features or points in the paper that in your view make it "very good science"?
Could it be that it tells him what he has already decided to believe?  :hmm:
No, no, it's that what he has already decided to believe is what the paper says, at least to Bluffy.
10
http://wavy.com/2017/11/21/mom-charged-after-putting-recording-device-in-daughters-backpack/amp/

Quote
She tells 10 On Your Side her 9-year-old daughter was getting bullied at Ocean View Elementary.  She says repeated calls and emails to the school went un-returned.

...

She wanted to prove that nothing was being done to help her 4th grade daughter.  She put a digital recorder into her daughter's backpack in hopes of catching audio from inside the classroom.

...

The recorder was found.  The 9-year-old was moved to a new classroom and about a month later Sims was charged by police.

Bright side (and a story I missed): https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/education/wp/2017/11/28/she-sent-her-child-to-school-with-a-recorder-to-catch-bullies-and-was-charged-with-a-felony/
Quote
Prosecutors in Virginia have dropped criminal charges against a mother who sent her 9-year-old daughter to school with an audio recorder in her backpack to see if the child was being bullied.

On the other hand,
Quote
Shattuck also said they have yet to find out what's in the recorder and suspect it may have captured something important.
Yeah, they need to get that tape back and if it's empty, have it analyzed for tampering and if there's been none, file suit for unlawful arrest. If there has been tampering, then then sue for tampering with evidence.

And if there is shit on the tape, full prosecution, including any officials involved including the apparent attempt at a cover up.

What I thought was really weird was the interviewing of the daughter without the knowledge of the mother much less her consent. I thought it was pretty much standard law that you can not interview minors without the consent of their parents/guardians or at least a court appointed monitor. A legacy of the great child abuse fake epidemic of the 80s.
11
Dammitall wants to talk about Trump on the other thread...

Let's talk about him here instead...

Jerusalem recognized

Terror ban upheld

UN Migrant Program dropped

TPP/Climate accord dropped

Roy Moore winning Senate race

CNN credibility destroyed

Russiagate debunked

Media/Democrat perverts exposed

MagaMarket exploding

Its only been one year
Dave, as someone living on planet Earth, allow me to inquire your current whereabouts.
Bluffoonylvania, of course!
12
NEITHER toddler group should get dental caries ...

IF NUTRITION IS ADEQUATE

Don't you think that many a toddler fell asleep while nursing it's mother in all these indigenous groups that Price visited?  Yet virtually no dental caries.

Why are you unable to think of these simple things yourself?  What is wrong with your thinking?  You have some sort of hellacious mental block.
Hey Bluffy, stop shitting yourself.
13
Here's another question for you, Dave:

Why would study after study show that nocturnal feeding, whether by bottle or breast, of infants of an age to have teeth, show that the nocturnal feeding, per se, was a strong risk factor for dental caries, if it were NOT a risk factor for dental caries?

Do you seriously think that somehow, all mothers who feed their toddlers at night are either more nutritionally deprived themselves, or that their children are more nutritionally deprived, than the mothers of children who do NOT feed them at night?
Sorry Pingu, but you need to dumb that all down.

A lot,

Yeah, I know.  And that is of course the problem.

If Dave can't work it out he is doomed to remain in ignorance.
Look at the bright side, ignorance is doomed to remain in Bluffy.
14
Here's another question for you, Dave:

Why would study after study show that nocturnal feeding, whether by bottle or breast, of infants of an age to have teeth, show that the nocturnal feeding, per se, was a strong risk factor for dental caries, if it were NOT a risk factor for dental caries?

Do you seriously think that somehow, all mothers who feed their toddlers at night are either more nutritionally deprived themselves, or that their children are more nutritionally deprived, than the mothers of children who do NOT feed them at night?
Sorry Pingu, but you need to dumb that all down.

A lot,
15
Dammitall wants to talk about Trump on the other thread...

Let's talk about him here instead...

Jerusalem recognized
  To what benefit? At what cost?

Terror ban upheld
To what benefit? At what cost? Please note, the ban does not include countries with which Trump has business ties and does not include the country from which 19 out of 20 of the 9/11 hijackers came.

UN Migrant Program dropped
Which accomplished what?

TPP/Climate accord dropped
And now the US is the lone country to not adopt the accords? Yay!!

Roy Moore winning Senate race
Yeah, we need more pedophiles in Congress. But you've already demonstrated your stance on pedophilia.

CNN credibility destroyed
Not really, except with those that already discounted it.

Russiagate debunked
Really?  You are on a flight of desperate fancy.

Media/Democrat perverts exposed
Along eith a bunch at Fox and a number of prominent business people and Republicans, including Trump himself and Roy Moore.

MagaMarket exploding
What's a MagaMarket?

Its only been one year
Once again, cherry picking results.
Yes, just imagine the damage to come.

Bluffy, stop shitting yourself.
16
It is no wonder our ecosystems (and our collective health) are being destroyed with anti-fact people like you running our universities.

Firstly, I do not "run" a university.

Second, you are full of shit.
Bluffy does enjoy shitting himself.
17
If I maintain a vegetable garden that supplies, say, 10% of my personal nutritional needs, and requires no inputs (other than tools and labor), do I have a "sustainable agriculture model"? :hmm:
To me it's "sustainable" if it improves or at least doesn't degrade the land on which it's produced.   That seems to be the most straightforward definition of "sustainable"  used in an agricultural context does it not?
No.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sustainable_agriculture
18
If I maintain a vegetable garden that supplies, say, 10% of my personal nutritional needs, and requires no inputs (other than tools and labor), do I have a "sustainable agriculture model"? :hmm:
To me it's "sustainable" if it improves or at least doesn't degrade the land on which it's produced.   That seems to be the most straightforward definition of "sustainable"  used in an agricultural context does it not?
No.
19
Where do we go sign if we want Trump in the trunk of the Tesla?
Aw, come on, strap* him into behind the wheel, have an exhaust soundtrack on the stereo and make sure the horn beeps. It'll keep him occupied on the trip.

*permanently
20
Obviously we can't turn the clock back.   But ... what I want to do is move the minds of some landowners to do something different with their land, namely, all families to re-colonize it for the purpose of homesteading and feeding their families, but with a different (better) agricultural model than the early American homesteaders had.
And I want a solid gold toilet seat.
I don't actually want any land, just a boat. A nice boat, maybe about 42'6" LOA, sloop rigged, center cockpit, fin keel, about 10 to 13 tons. Electric wiches would be nice, along with full furling/reefing sails and a nice suite of navitronics.
21
Hmm I wonder if there are any wealthy people in the world who are involved in charity work.
Hmm I wonder if Dave Hawkins will have any more luck convincing any of them of the plausibility of his fantasy than he has had here?

Or any landowners at all, regardless of wealth status.

Dave has no interest in workable things like community gardens, allotments, etc., but thinks landowners should be willing to parcel their arable land out to 'worthy producers'.

One of two things happens to land owned by individuals here: they leave it to their children, or, having no children/relatives, they leave it to conservation trusts to be held as wildlife refuges.
I suggest this is Bluffy's scheme de jour for no other reason than he really has no other option to believe in. He doesn't have the resources nor much hope of ever obtaining such, at least not while living the subsistence lifestyle he's chosen and selling windows for Sears. I think he realizes, even if subconciously, his schemes haven't a rat's chance at a cat show of attracting effective investors, given their lack of wide-spread attractiveness (tarp-roofed, unfinished straw bale hovels with plastic film windows and micro-fiber blanket doors, shitting in buckets, no running water, living primarily on raw milk, etc while selling windows on commission and supplementing ones diet with fast food) and so his only hope is some sort of mysterious benefactor who simply wants to do the right thing.

It's an attractive dream and we all know how much Bluffy loves for things that make sense to him to be real.
22
Many operators say "my cows are 100% grass" but they are in fact not bc they consume a fair amount of grain while being milked twice a day.
There's one operator in Missouri who has less than zero credibility and is known to fabricate fantasies, engage in quote-mining and welches on his bets plus has a long standing disregard for civil law.

I don't think he should be allowed to sell raw milk, I mean ,he doesn't even wash his hands and has cats lick his milk cans clean.
Slanderers who lie about people like me are dangerous to society. TR members should call out posters like RAFH for this kind of calumnious behavior. 

I actually have a high regard for civil law as evidence by my recent work with my county to get approvals.  My highest respect for civil law goes to COUNTIES. I have less respect for local municipalities who often act like bullies as does state and federal government at times.

As for unwashed hands, you are betraying your ignorance of microbiology.
Hey Bluffy, what calumnious behavior on my part?

First off, I did not name you, But I guess you recognize the character.
Secondly, assuming your assumption is correct, you do have less than zero credibility, at least in this local community.
Next, you are, at least in this local community, know to fabricate, rather profusely.
And it was you that revealed, with pride, that you don't wash your hands as well as you have your cats lick clean your milking cans.
You have repeatedly welched on bets, that's all in the archives, despite your claim to have paid the NCSE, they never received the money.
Lastly, you have shown disdain for civil law. You make it clear even in this post. Oh, wait, it's only civil law that doesn't favor you that you disdain, sort of sounds like you've had some run-ins with local law enforcement, possibly moving violations or parking fines.

So nothing to call me out on. Nothing at all.

You, on the other hand, regularly accuse people, entire professions, of falsifying or tampering with data and lying to children. Simply because you don't like reality.
23
Seems like the easiest system would be to award use of a tract of land to an applicant for say 5 years and track "carrying capacity" ... that is, how many total animal units (AU) the land can support with no commercial feed inputs year by year. As long as the applicant achieves a certain baseline production, he can continue ... if not, then somebody else gets a shot.
But that automatically favors the first user, how do you decide who that will be.

It also seems like you are writing the rules to specifically favor your preferred operation.
Given such obvious bias and your lack of credibility, we're going to have to disqualify you, permanently.
24
Many operators say "my cows are 100% grass" but they are in fact not bc they consume a fair amount of grain while being milked twice a day.
There's one operator in Missouri who has less than zero credibility and is known to fabricate fantasies, engage in quote-mining and welches on his bets plus has a long standing disregard for civil law.

I don't think he should be allowed to sell raw milk, I mean ,he doesn't even wash his hands and has cats lick his milk cans clean.
25
I would absolutely LOVE IT if I could go find some nice pasture land in Johnson Co. Missouri and apply for "productive use ownership rights" and set up a rotationally grazed food system.
What if someone else wants the same land?

I mean, I'd LOVE IT if I could go to San Simeon and apply for productive use ownership and set up an awesome party production, the awesomest ever!!