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Topic: Anti-vax stupidity from Cleveland Clinic MD (Read 3469 times) previous topic - next topic

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Re: Anti-vax stupidity from Cleveland Clinic MD
Reply #50
I guess that

"Omigod .... someone said something negative about vaccines"

Is ALT science

Glad to see that ... bc it sure as hell isnt real science

It appears that this doctor is simply "seeking to falsify" some parts of Holy Vaccine Dogma ... which constitutes good science

But tarring and feathering him with lies is bad science .... or ALT science
  • Last Edit: January 08, 2017, 09:15:37 AM by Dave Hawkins

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Re: Anti-vax stupidity from Cleveland Clinic MD
Reply #51
Dave did you play with mercury as a child?

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Re: Anti-vax stupidity from Cleveland Clinic MD
Reply #52
Geez, I didn't know that Wakefield had met with Trump:

https://www.statnews.com/2016/11/30/donald-trump-vaccines-policy/?s_campaign=trendmd
So maybe Neides isn't just angling for a job with foodbabe.com or Mercola's scam operation.
Maybe he's angling for a Trump administration appointment - CDC director? - after he gets fired from Cleveland Clinic tomorrow.
"I understand Donald Trump better than many people because I really am a lot like him." - Dave Hawkins

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Re: Anti-vax stupidity from Cleveland Clinic MD
Reply #53
And yeah ... feel free to move my posts ... tyrants all through history have silenced their critics

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Re: Anti-vax stupidity from Cleveland Clinic MD
Reply #54
"Gets fired tomorrow"

Talk about despicable

Sad thing is he probably will be

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Re: Anti-vax stupidity from Cleveland Clinic MD
Reply #55
Geez, I didn't know that Wakefield had met with Trump:

https://www.statnews.com/2016/11/30/donald-trump-vaccines-policy/?s_campaign=trendmd
So maybe Neides isn't just angling for a job with foodbabe.com or Mercola's scam operation.
Maybe he's angling for a Trump administration appointment - CDC director? - after he gets fired from Cleveland Clinic tomorrow.

It's a terrible article by any metric.  I mean, it's hard to believe the guy had any kind of academic training at all, let alone a medical training.  It's chock full of non sequiturs, sweeping, meaningless generalisations, and unsupported claims.  Even if you didn't know any facts at all, you could tell it was bullshit.


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Re: Anti-vax stupidity from Cleveland Clinic MD
Reply #56
I guess that

"Omigod .... someone said something negative about vaccines"

Is ALT science

Glad to see that ... bc it sure as hell isnt real science

It appears that this doctor is simply "seeking to falsify" some parts of Holy Vaccine Dogma ... which constitutes good science

But tarring and feathering him with lies is bad science .... or ALT science
He's mindlessly spouting the same old long-debunked bullshit. He's not doing any form of science, alt or not.
"I would never consider my evaluation of his work to be fair minded unless I had actually read his own words." - Dave Hawkins

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Re: Anti-vax stupidity from Cleveland Clinic MD
Reply #57
And yeah ... feel free to move my posts ... tyrants all through history have silenced their critics
Moving your posts is not censorship.
"I would never consider my evaluation of his work to be fair minded unless I had actually read his own words." - Dave Hawkins

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Re: Anti-vax stupidity from Cleveland Clinic MD
Reply #58
Dave, if you started writing blog posts about how windows were a scam, and dangerous, especially double glazed ones, how long do you think you'd keep your job with Sears?
Why do I bother?

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Re: Anti-vax stupidity from Cleveland Clinic MD
Reply #59
That's not what he wrote

You're lying

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Re: Anti-vax stupidity from Cleveland Clinic MD
Reply #60
Guys.

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Re: Anti-vax stupidity from Cleveland Clinic MD
Reply #61
And yeah ... feel free to move my posts ... tyrants all through history have silenced their critics
Moving your posts is not censorship.
No, it isn't. It is, however, not within TR's charter crap to move them. He's posting on the topic, even if what he posts is stupid.  If the rest of you would NOT RESPOND to him, that might be helpful.

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Re: Anti-vax stupidity from Cleveland Clinic MD
Reply #62
Here's some substance ...

God created my immune system and the immune systems of my kids and grandkids.

Stop fucking with our immune systems and lying about it.
No. That is not "substance".
The fact that you think it is just confirms that you don't know the difference between science and cheerleading.
But I suppose you could call this:
That's essentially what the author (Voxrat's new witch burning target) in the article is saying as well.
... "substance", in that you are making a falsifiable claim.  So I'll respond.

No, that is definitely NOT what he is saying, "essentially" or otherwise.
Nowhere in the article does he say anything that could be remotely construed as anyone "fucking with our immune systems", or "lying about it". 

The article is about alleged effects of alleged "toxins". The only, tangential, connection with immune system disorders is in his mention in passing (with no support whatsoever) of unspecified "auto-immune diseases" among a litany of other problems hand-wavily attributed to unspecified "toxins" - no connection with any specific vaccine or vaccines in general.

In fact he admits that - as far as immunity goes - vaccines do what they are supposed to
Quote
Some of the vaccines have helped reduce the incidence of childhood communicable diseases, like meningitis and pneumonia. That is great news. ...
So let me be clear - vaccines can be helpful when used properly.

You claim to have read the guy's article, but you appear not to even have Hawkinzed it.
And you have the temerity to accuse meepmeep of being a "fucking liar" for "misrepresenting" it.

Despicable.
Bluffy goes by the handle Temerity Dave in some parts of the country.
Are we there yet?

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Re: Anti-vax stupidity from Cleveland Clinic MD
Reply #63
Here's some substance ...

God created my immune system and the immune systems of my kids and grandkids.

Stop fucking with our immune systems and lying about it.
Content-free bluster.

What did meppmeep misrepresent?  Your silence says "nothing".
Well first of all, she claimed that he wrote "thimerosol = death" and "formaldehyde = death"

But he did  not write that.

A lie.
So the above are not Practical Simplifications, or whatever the hell you call it when YOU do it?
Who even made the rule that we cannot group ducks and fish together for the simple reason that they are both aquatic? If I want to group them that way and it serves my purpose then I can jolly well do it however I want to and it is still a nested hierarchy and you can't tell me that it's not.

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Re: Anti-vax stupidity from Cleveland Clinic MD
Reply #64
No. They're lies.

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Re: Anti-vax stupidity from Cleveland Clinic MD
Reply #65
I guess that

"Omigod .... someone said something negative about vaccines"

Is ALT science

Glad to see that ... bc it sure as hell isnt real science

It appears that this doctor is simply "seeking to falsify" some parts of Holy Vaccine Dogma ... which constitutes good science

But tarring and feathering him with lies is bad science .... or ALT science
Oh-oh. I see no mention of "Omigod .... someone said something negative about vaccines" in any post by anyone else in this thread. And yet, here it is, in quotes.

I guess that makes you a fucking liar then, dave.

RIGHT?
Who even made the rule that we cannot group ducks and fish together for the simple reason that they are both aquatic? If I want to group them that way and it serves my purpose then I can jolly well do it however I want to and it is still a nested hierarchy and you can't tell me that it's not.

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Re: Anti-vax stupidity from Cleveland Clinic MD
Reply #66
No. They're lies.
So you're a fucking liar yourself, according to your own claims.

Good to know.



ETA: Aand that was my last response to dave on this thread.
Who even made the rule that we cannot group ducks and fish together for the simple reason that they are both aquatic? If I want to group them that way and it serves my purpose then I can jolly well do it however I want to and it is still a nested hierarchy and you can't tell me that it's not.

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Re: Anti-vax stupidity from Cleveland Clinic MD
Reply #67
That's not what he wrote

You're lying
Well, no, because his article is about vaccines and "toxins" and contains the usual bingo cards for formaldehyde and mercury, and feeling a bit poorly after having a flu shot (rather than actually going down with the actual flu, which knocks you out for more than a couple of days) rather than being about windows.

So I ask again. How long do you think you'd keep your job if you made comparable statements about double glazing?
Why do I bother?

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Re: Anti-vax stupidity from Cleveland Clinic MD
Reply #68
And yeah ... feel free to move my posts ... tyrants all through history have silenced their critics
Has anyone suggested this?
Or are you just feeding into your own persecution/martyr fantasy?

I should add, suggested moving them, and only them (Bluffy's) solely because of their content rather than as Vox suggested, moving that entire discussion to a new thread, as this was clogging up this one as a distraction.
  • Last Edit: January 08, 2017, 10:02:54 AM by RAFH
Are we there yet?

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Re: Anti-vax stupidity from Cleveland Clinic MD
Reply #69
Quote from: Neides
But not at the expense of neurologic diseases like autism and ADHD increasing at alarming rates.

When I was in medical school in the late 1980s, the rate of autism was 1 in 1,000 children. For those born in the 1950's and 60's, do you recall a single student in your grade with an Individualized Education Program (IEP) for ADHD or someone with a diagnosis of autism? I do not.

As of 2010, the rate of autism in the U.S. escalated to 1 in 68 children. The deniers will simply state that we do a better job of diagnosing this "disorder". Really?

No.  There are at least two diagnostic factors at work - rate of detection, and changes in diagnostic criteria. For instance changes in the DSM have reflected the recognition that autism is a spectrum disorder, and that it makes sense to include children with less severe forms in the diagnostic category.  The DSM5 actually abolishes the distinction between "Asperger's Syndrome" and "High Functioning Autism" as it turns out there was no robust distinction between the two.

A population-based cohort study in Denmark found that 60% of the increase in Denmark was attributable to changes in diagnostic criteria - a factor Neides doesn't even bother to mention.  That study does imply that there may be a real underlying increase.  It is important to find out what this might be due to.  Another population-based cohort study in Denmark found NO additional risk associated with the MMR triple vaccine, the one implicated by Wakefield. Other studies have found NO additional risk associated with thimerosal. Some spatial clustering of cases has been found, indicating spatial variation in diagnostic resources, and possibly environmental pollutants. Another risk factor is maternal infection during pregnancy, including influenza.

As for ADHD, evidence suggests that prevalence has been unchanged over 3 decades, and that rates are similar world wide.

This guy can't even do a basic literature search apparently.  Or doesn't want to.

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Re: Anti-vax stupidity from Cleveland Clinic MD
Reply #70
And yeah ... feel free to move my posts ... tyrants all through history have silenced their critics
Moving your posts is not censorship.
No, it isn't. It is, however, not within TR's charter crap to move them. He's posting on the topic, even if what he posts is stupid.  If the rest of you would NOT RESPOND to him, that might be helpful.
^^^^

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Re: Anti-vax stupidity from Cleveland Clinic MD
Reply #71
Geez, I didn't know that Wakefield had met with Trump:

https://www.statnews.com/2016/11/30/donald-trump-vaccines-policy/?s_campaign=trendmd


Fuck this administration with a red hot poker.
Love is like a magic penny
 if you hold it tight you won't have any
if you give it away you'll have so many
they'll be rolling all over the floor

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Re: Anti-vax stupidity from Cleveland Clinic MD
Reply #72
Geez, I didn't know that Wakefield had met with Trump:

https://www.statnews.com/2016/11/30/donald-trump-vaccines-policy/?s_campaign=trendmd
So maybe Neides isn't just angling for a job with foodbabe.com or Mercola's scam operation.
Maybe he's angling for a Trump administration appointment - CDC director? - after he gets fired from Cleveland Clinic tomorrow.

It's a terrible article by any metric.  I mean, it's hard to believe the guy had any kind of academic training at all, let alone a medical training.  It's chock full of non sequiturs, sweeping, meaningless generalisations, and unsupported claims.  Even if you didn't know any facts at all, you could tell it was bullshit.


I don't know why, but medical doctors have a weird tendency for being spectacularly ignorant people.

Eta: I should have qualified that although I am not sure what the qualification should be. Maybe I'm sure some of them are good people? I have also known very knowledgeable Dr's though they haven't exactly been a majority.
  • Last Edit: January 08, 2017, 10:24:22 AM by Testy Calibrate
Love is like a magic penny
 if you hold it tight you won't have any
if you give it away you'll have so many
they'll be rolling all over the floor

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Re: Anti-vax stupidity from Cleveland Clinic MD
Reply #73
Geez, I didn't know that Wakefield had met with Trump:

https://www.statnews.com/2016/11/30/donald-trump-vaccines-policy/?s_campaign=trendmd
So maybe Neides isn't just angling for a job with foodbabe.com or Mercola's scam operation.
Maybe he's angling for a Trump administration appointment - CDC director? - after he gets fired from Cleveland Clinic tomorrow.

It's a terrible article by any metric.  I mean, it's hard to believe the guy had any kind of academic training at all, let alone a medical training.  It's chock full of non sequiturs, sweeping, meaningless generalisations, and unsupported claims.  Even if you didn't know any facts at all, you could tell it was bullshit.


I don't know why, but medical doctors have a weird tendency for being spectacularly ignorant people.

Well, we do try to train them to evaluate evidence.  I do my tiny bit.

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Re: Anti-vax stupidity from Cleveland Clinic MD
Reply #74
And yeah ... feel free to move my posts ... tyrants all through history have silenced their critics
Moving your posts is not censorship.
No, it isn't. It is, however, not within TR's charter crap to move them. He's posting on the topic, even if what he posts is stupid.  If the rest of you would NOT RESPOND to him, that might be helpful.
^^^^
Ah, Moms, it's fun to poke Bluffy. And, besides, he likes it.
Are we there yet?