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Topic: Economics of "Saving Agriculture" (Thereby Saving the World) (Read 178226 times) previous topic - next topic

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  • Photon
  • I interfere with myself
Re: Economics of "Saving Agriculture" (Thereby Saving the World)
Reply #28200
and Borealis I did not make a "faux pas."  it was an honest statement from a normal red-blooded male member of the human species.

 honest statements are rare these days, so it understandably took you by surprise.
Your digusting ideals are not representative of all men, let alone a representation of honesty, a task for which you have NOT shown an aptitude. Your constant lies and evasions and justifications for your stupid decisions and sexist, selfish desires, are well-documented, Dave.

Re: Economics of "Saving Agriculture" (Thereby Saving the World)
Reply #28201
Sexism is culture
Love is like a magic penny
 if you hold it tight you won't have any
if you give it away you'll have so many
they'll be rolling all over the floor

  • Faid
Re: Economics of "Saving Agriculture" (Thereby Saving the World)
Reply #28202
Faid is a hypocrite
Sit and spin, dave.

I asked you to do a simple thing:
Quote
    
Quote
She might consider it an honor because of his great wisdom and virtue for all you know.


:facepalm:

Sure dave. Now turn this around. Imagine that your 15-year old daughter informs you that she got a marriage proposal by a 74-year old retired professor, and that she accepted because she "considers it an honor because of his great wisdom and virtue".
Can you imagine your reaction to THAT? Or is someone else the hypocrite here?
Different culture.
So your concept of right and wrong depends on the culture?
Guess I was wrong. C. S. Lewis is not just turning in his grave: He's clawing his way out and coming for you.

 
Quote
this is why I put you on ignore for several years. It's because you are dishonest and you don't know how to carry our honest debate
Lol. You've never had me on ignore, you hypocrite.
Who even made the rule that we cannot group ducks and fish together for the simple reason that they are both aquatic? If I want to group them that way and it serves my purpose then I can jolly well do it however I want to and it is still a nested hierarchy and you can't tell me that it's not.

  • borealis
  • Administrator
Re: Economics of "Saving Agriculture" (Thereby Saving the World)
Reply #28203
Sexism is culture

Sexism is culture, but sexual predation may not be quite so easily explained. I've seen at lest one serious study that indicated that 80% of sexual assaults in universities are committed by only 6% of male students. There is a subgroup of men who are serial predators, where the majority of men may be sexist to one degree or another, but they are not sexual predators.

  • Photon
  • I interfere with myself
Re: Economics of "Saving Agriculture" (Thereby Saving the World)
Reply #28204

Sexism is culture

Maybe so... But maybe that, finally, is changing in a few places.

Re: Economics of "Saving Agriculture" (Thereby Saving the World)
Reply #28205
Anyway ... the Masai ...  I have now posted two articles which contradict this idea that the Masai don't get enough to eat and that they live these horrible brutal short lives. They seem quite happy to me.

  • VoxRat
  • wtactualf
Re: Economics of "Saving Agriculture" (Thereby Saving the World)
Reply #28206
and Borealis I did not make a "faux pas."  it was an honest statement from a normal red-blooded male member of the human species.
No, Dave.
You are speaking strictly for yourself here.
Visualizing myself (or a 74-year old) having sex with a 15 year-old girl honestly does not elicit a response anything like a "woo-hoo" from me.
Quote
honest statements are rare these days, so it understandably took you by surprise.
But self-congratulatory statements are pretty standard coming from you, so no surprise there.
"I understand Donald Trump better than many people because I really am a lot like him." - Dave Hawkins

  • VoxRat
  • wtactualf
Re: Economics of "Saving Agriculture" (Thereby Saving the World)
Reply #28207
Anyway ... the Masai ...  I have now posted two articles which contradict this idea that the Masai don't get enough to eat and that they live these horrible brutal short lives. They seem quite happy to me.
Dave "All/None" Hawkins strikes again.
Anyway the "enough to eat" you posted about sounded nothing like the all-animal/no-vegetable diet you are defending so what, exactly, IS your point?  :dunno:
"I understand Donald Trump better than many people because I really am a lot like him." - Dave Hawkins

  • borealis
  • Administrator
Re: Economics of "Saving Agriculture" (Thereby Saving the World)
Reply #28208
Anyway ... the Masai ...  I have now posted two articles which contradict this idea that the Masai don't get enough to eat and that they live these horrible brutal short lives. They seem quite happy to me.

No you have not. The very article by the teacher, which you cited, speaks of their food shortages. If you look up 'Maasai' on wikipedia, the serious problem of hunger among the tribal clans is brought up. Countless articles reference hunger, because their nomadic lifestyle and dependence on cattle leads to a marginal existence that depends entirely on climate, weather, and vast landscapes to support their cows. All of which is exacerbated by borders and politics and white tourists with money.

How the hell would you know if they are 'quite happy' or not? And how does momentary 'happiness' indicate whether or not their lives are short or long? No one has said their lives are 'horrible, brutal'. We say they experience hunger more often than is good for people, we say some aspects of their culture are detrimental, particularly for women, who suffer and may die from FGM.

People can experience hunger, pain, deprivation, loss, grief, and still experience happiness in their lives. That doesn't mean their lives are ideal.

  • JonF
Re: Economics of "Saving Agriculture" (Thereby Saving the World)
Reply #28209
Anyway ... the Masai ...  I have now posted two articles which contradict this idea that the Masai don't get enough to eat and that they live these horrible brutal short lives. They seem quite happy to me.
You haven't posted anything on the topic of life expectancy. Guess you still haven't figured out that the existence of an old person doesn't tell you anything about that culture's life expectancy.
"I would never consider my evaluation of his work to be fair minded unless I had actually read his own words." - Dave Hawkins

Re: Economics of "Saving Agriculture" (Thereby Saving the World)
Reply #28210
 just taking the words of that female English teacher at face value... That's all...

  • borealis
  • Administrator
Re: Economics of "Saving Agriculture" (Thereby Saving the World)
Reply #28211
Dave, you need to quit romanticising indigenous peoples. I'm guessing you enjoyed your childhood among the waiwai, and from that stems your idealising of native cultures. But you were a child, and the waiwai are one people, you cannot project their experience and your childhood experience upon all indigenous peoples.

Your lack of knowledge continually raises its head, from your referencing 'pretty indian pictures' through your knowing nothing about traditional housing of NA nations beyond 'tipis', your casual dismissal of real information about indigenous diet and lifestyle, to your refusal to confront destructive cultural traditions and practices.

They are all people, Dave, subject to ordinary human realities.

  • VoxRat
  • wtactualf
Re: Economics of "Saving Agriculture" (Thereby Saving the World)
Reply #28212
So, you aren't morally or objectively against men trying to fuck teenaged women per se, it's just that niggling culture that gets in the way. Why, if it weren't for inconvenient cultural judgement, Dave sees nothing wrong with adult men moving like a bitch on underaged girls.

Dave, you have two young daughters, ffs, would you want a 55-year-old man trying to fuck them?
Here's the creepy video of Donald Trump saying he'd date his own daughter

Quote from: Dave Hawkins
I understand Donald Trump better than many people because I really am a lot like him.
"I understand Donald Trump better than many people because I really am a lot like him." - Dave Hawkins

  • Y.B
Re: Economics of "Saving Agriculture" (Thereby Saving the World)
Reply #28213
Itt I learned that a Christian fundamentalist can also be a cultural and apparently moral relativist. When it suits him, anyway.

Re: Economics of "Saving Agriculture" (Thereby Saving the World)
Reply #28214
Sexism is culture

Sexism is culture, but sexual predation may not be quite so easily explained. I've seen at lest one serious study that indicated that 80% of sexual assaults in universities are committed by only 6% of male students. There is a subgroup of men who are serial predators, where the majority of men may be sexist to one degree or another, but they are not sexual predators.
I think the idea of sexual predators is expanding. I'm sure there are subpopulations that have stronger tendencies toward more violent behavior but rape culture is a real thing and I don't think it's a simple matter to untangle it to a few buzzwords.
Love is like a magic penny
 if you hold it tight you won't have any
if you give it away you'll have so many
they'll be rolling all over the floor

  • borealis
  • Administrator
Re: Economics of "Saving Agriculture" (Thereby Saving the World)
Reply #28215
Sexism is culture

Sexism is culture, but sexual predation may not be quite so easily explained. I've seen at lest one serious study that indicated that 80% of sexual assaults in universities are committed by only 6% of male students. There is a subgroup of men who are serial predators, where the majority of men may be sexist to one degree or another, but they are not sexual predators.
I think the idea of sexual predators is expanding. I'm sure there are subpopulations that have stronger tendencies toward more violent behavior but rape culture is a real thing and I don't think it's a simple matter to untangle it to a few buzzwords.

Yes, rape culture is a real thing. I'm not sure what you're getting at  re 'buzzwords'. What buzzwords?

Do you think sexual predators don't exist? Why, then, do you think that every friend group of women, particularly in smaller towns, ordinarily passes around information about men the others might encounter who have a history of groping or assault? The guy who owns <redacted> business, don't be alone with him. This guy who hangs out in this bar/tavern/club is dangerous, watch yourself. That politician has history, be wary.

It has always been difficult to get anywhere with police/justice system if you haven't been violently raped and beaten. It's more trouble than it's worth if you've escaped with only your pride, dignity, bodily integrity and trust seriously harmed. So you tell your friends and they tell their friends and you hope the word spreads enough to protect most women who might have contact with that subgroup of men in your town.

  • Faid
Re: Economics of "Saving Agriculture" (Thereby Saving the World)
Reply #28216
When dave contemplates the idea of his OWN 15-yo daughter marrying an old man, he casually dismisses it because it's not what's considered right in our "culture".

But when he imagines HIMSELF as the one marrying a 15-yo girl, his own "culture" concepts of right/wrong do not seem to prevent him from going "woo-hoo".

In fact, he uses BIOLOGICAL arguments to justify his stance. and he suddenly considers the OTHER culture, the one where that's acceptable, as better in that regard, for being "closer to nature".

And I'm the "hypocrite".


Right.
Who even made the rule that we cannot group ducks and fish together for the simple reason that they are both aquatic? If I want to group them that way and it serves my purpose then I can jolly well do it however I want to and it is still a nested hierarchy and you can't tell me that it's not.

  • Faid
Re: Economics of "Saving Agriculture" (Thereby Saving the World)
Reply #28217
just taking the words of that female English teacher at face value... That's all...
Except for when she talks about many not having enough food. Then she obviously refers to other groups, and not the RealMasai(TM) she lived with.

Hypocrisy, thy name is AFDave.
Who even made the rule that we cannot group ducks and fish together for the simple reason that they are both aquatic? If I want to group them that way and it serves my purpose then I can jolly well do it however I want to and it is still a nested hierarchy and you can't tell me that it's not.

Re: Economics of "Saving Agriculture" (Thereby Saving the World)
Reply #28218
I thought everyone knew Dave Hawkins of Odessa, MO is a child woo hoo'er. It's been an open secret for years

  • JonF
Re: Economics of "Saving Agriculture" (Thereby Saving the World)
Reply #28219
just taking the words of that female English teacher at face value... That's all...
And ignoring all the other evidence.
"I would never consider my evaluation of his work to be fair minded unless I had actually read his own words." - Dave Hawkins

Re: Economics of "Saving Agriculture" (Thereby Saving the World)
Reply #28220
When dave contemplates the idea of his OWN 15-yo daughter marrying an old man, he casually dismisses it because it's not what's considered right in our "culture".

But when he imagines HIMSELF as the one marrying a 15-yo girl, his own "culture" concepts of right/wrong do not seem to prevent him from going "woo-hoo".

In fact, he uses BIOLOGICAL arguments to justify his stance. and he suddenly considers the OTHER culture, the one where that's acceptable, as better in that regard, for being "closer to nature".

And I'm the "hypocrite".


Right.
I'm not imagining marrying a 15-year-old girl in MY culture. But any man that pretends to not have ever had a "Solomon" fantasy (this 74 year old dude is a bit of a miniature Solomon it seems) is just plain lying. You're a hypocrite bc I KNOW you have had fantasies like this bc I know men.  Are you really going to sit here with a straight face and tell me "Dave if I were that old Masai patriarch dude I'd stand up for righteousness, dammit, and set a new standard by not marrying that gal!" ....Is that what you'd say?  Hell no you wouldn't. You are the type of guy that pretty "does what everyone in your culture does" are you not? Why would you suddenly be a fish who swims upstream if you were Masai? Come on. Get real.

Re: Economics of "Saving Agriculture" (Thereby Saving the World)
Reply #28221
When dave contemplates the idea of his OWN 15-yo daughter marrying an old man, he casually dismisses it because it's not what's considered right in our "culture".

But when he imagines HIMSELF as the one marrying a 15-yo girl, his own "culture" concepts of right/wrong do not seem to prevent him from going "woo-hoo".

In fact, he uses BIOLOGICAL arguments to justify his stance. and he suddenly considers the OTHER culture, the one where that's acceptable, as better in that regard, for being "closer to nature".

And I'm the "hypocrite".


Right.
I'm not imagining marrying a 15-year-old girl in MY culture. But any man that pretends to not have ever had a "Solomon" fantasy (this 74 year old dude is a bit of a miniature Solomon it seems) is just plain lying. You're a hypocrite bc I KNOW you have had fantasies like this bc I know men.  Are you really going to sit here with a straight face and tell me "Dave if I were that old Masai patriarch dude I'd stand up for righteousness, dammit, and set a new standard by not marrying that gal!" ....Is that what you'd say?  Hell no you wouldn't. You are the type of guy that pretty "does what everyone in your culture does" are you not? Why would you suddenly be a fish who swims upstream if you were Masai? Come on. Get real.
Is that why you go on sex tours of Asia? To visit other cultures?

Re: Economics of "Saving Agriculture" (Thereby Saving the World)
Reply #28222
Dave this is fucked up reasoning on your part.

what's really weird to me is the reason why you - a nontheist and  evolutionist -- would be lecturing me, a theist and creationist about the morality of "non-standard" marriage arrangements.

How stupid are you to think atheists or evolutionists have no morality?

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YOU - supposedly -  believe that humans are just another animal and I think that most other animals have polygamous "marriages" and I don't think males have any compunctions against sexual relations with females that have just recently reached puberty. ( or whatever you call it in non-humans )

Showing your ignorance about the natural world as usual. Most male mammals instinctively know if a female is mature enough to mate with, through scent or other signs. Contrary to your notion of a seething rutting natural condition, many animals, particularly birds and mammals, are monogamous, mating for a season or for life..

Not really. While they may pair up for a season there's absolutely no guarantee of sexual fidelity - in fact in most birds "extra-pair copulation" is rife and many of the offspring a male raises aren't his, but he will often have fathered offspring in another bird's nest.  
Why do I bother?

Re: Economics of "Saving Agriculture" (Thereby Saving the World)
Reply #28223
Heh

  • VoxRat
  • wtactualf
Re: Economics of "Saving Agriculture" (Thereby Saving the World)
Reply #28224
any man that pretends to not have ever had a "Solomon" fantasy (this 74 year old dude is a bit of a miniature Solomon it seems) is just plain lying. You're a hypocrite bc I KNOW you have had fantasies like this bc I know men.
No, Dave.
You know some men.
Maybe all the men you happen to know have confided to you that they have these fantasies.
I would be surprised, but maybe that's the circles you travel in.
But I can assure you that, no, not all men have those fantasies.

BTW...
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this 74 year old dude is a bit of a miniature Solomon it seems
That's my impression, too.
Which makes me think that he and his harem/family are probably not representative of typical Maasai.
I.e. not particularly relevant to the point you were trying to make, bringing up this particular story.
(Not to mention [ahem] that their diet was nothing like the all-animal/no-vegetable diet whose virtues you are presumably trying to illustrate).
"I understand Donald Trump better than many people because I really am a lot like him." - Dave Hawkins