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Topic: Dave presents his OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE of global flood, no badgering! (Read 2367 times) previous topic - next topic

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  • Zombies!
  • These violent delights have violent ends.
Dave presents his OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE of global flood, no badgering!
Well Dave, let'r rip.
Here's your shot after a dozen or so years to have a thread dedicated to the global flood.
Let's see what you do here!
I really should call your department head and tell him or her how badly you are behaving while posing as a credentialed professional scientist.

  • SkepticTank
  • Global Moderator
  • Calmer than you are
Re: Dave presents his OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE of global flood, no badgering!
Reply #1

  • RickB
Re: Dave presents his OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE of global flood, no badgering!
Reply #2
It would appear that Dave has no evidence at all, let alone 'overwhelming' evidence.

Is anyone surprised?


  • ffejrxx
Re: Dave presents his OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE of global flood, no badgering!
Reply #3
does dave use the FSM form of proof on this forum?

all evidence pointing tward it is placed deliberately so it must not be real

Re: Dave presents his OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE of global flood, no badgering!
Reply #4
I've posted evidence for the Flood many times before ... some examples better than others ...

Here's one of my all time favorites ...

The sandstone layer that includes the Tapeats but has many different names all across North America ... I was first made aware of the remarkable nature of this sandstone layer by Bill Hoesch of ICR ... https://www.icr.org/article/3342/ ...

This layer is enormous ... covering a majority of the land area of the N. Am continent ...

Also it's incredibly flat ...

And it's incredibly thin ...

There is no process occurring today which could possibly create anything remotely close to such a layer.  (No the Bahamas doesn't cut it)

While you cannot look at this layer by itself and conclude "Global Flood" ... you CAN look at it and conclude ... "Gigantic continent sized hydraulic cataclysm the likes of which has never been equalled in all of recorded history."

From that conclusion, it's only a small step, employing other evidence, to "Global Flood"

You're welcome.

  • Martin.au
  • Thingyologist
Re: Dave presents his OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE of global flood, no badgering!
Reply #5
No. See previous thread on the subject. You don't get to ignore the previous threads you dishonest schmuck.

6th law!!!
  • Last Edit: January 22, 2018, 02:21:26 AM by Martin.au
"That which can be asserted with evidence can also be dismissed without evidence." (Dave Hawkins)

Re: Dave presents his OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE of global flood, no badgering!
Reply #6
Dave, in your opinion, is the Tapeat sandstone layer the one that was deposited by the flood?

  • VoxRat
  • wtactualf
Re: Dave presents his OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE of global flood, no badgering!
Reply #7
I've posted evidence for the Flood many times before ... some examples better than others ...

Here's one of my all time favorites ...

The sandstone layer that includes the Tapeats but has many different names all across North America ... I was first made aware of the remarkable nature of this sandstone layer by Bill Hoesch of ICR ... https://www.icr.org/article/3342/ ...

This layer is enormous ... covering a majority of the land area of the N. Am continent ...

Also it's incredibly flat ...

And it's incredibly thin ...

There is no process occurring today which could possibly create anything remotely close to such a layer.  (No the Bahamas doesn't cut it)

While you cannot look at this layer by itself and conclude "Global Flood" ... you CAN look at it and conclude ... "Gigantic continent sized hydraulic cataclysm the likes of which has never been equalled in all of recorded history."

From that conclusion, it's only a small step, employing other evidence, to "Global Flood"

You're welcome.
this doesn't even rise to the level of pathetic.
"I understand Donald Trump better than many people because I really am a lot like him." - Dave Hawkins

Re: Dave presents his OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE of global flood, no badgering!
Reply #8
Dave, in your opinion, is the Tapeat sandstone layer the one that was deposited by the flood?
"the one" ??? There were many layers deposited during the global flood. Yes I think the Tapeats Sandstone was deposited sometime during the global flood year.

  • VoxRat
  • wtactualf
Re: Dave presents his OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE of global flood, no badgering!
Reply #9
Dave, in your opinion, is the Tapeat sandstone layer the one that was deposited by the flood?
"the one" ??? There were many layers deposited during the global flood. Yes I think the Tapeats Sandstone was deposited sometime during the global flood year.
this thread is about evidence. Not beliefs.
"I understand Donald Trump better than many people because I really am a lot like him." - Dave Hawkins

  • uncool
Re: Dave presents his OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE of global flood, no badgering!
Reply #10
Eh, vox, he was asked his opinion. No need to berate him for answering the question as asked.

  • VoxRat
  • wtactualf
Re: Dave presents his OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE of global flood, no badgering!
Reply #11
OK. Fair enough.
It turns out the thread is about opinions.
"I understand Donald Trump better than many people because I really am a lot like him." - Dave Hawkins

Re: Dave presents his OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE of global flood, no badgering!
Reply #12
Dave, in your opinion, is the Tapeat sandstone layer the one that was deposited by the flood?
"the one" ??? There were many layers deposited during the global flood. Yes I think the Tapeats Sandstone was deposited sometime during the global flood year.

Ah, so there were many. Which ones? And are they also widespread?

Re: Dave presents his OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE of global flood, no badgering!
Reply #13
Because I do not see how it can be considered evidence of a flood at all.

  • VoxRat
  • wtactualf
Re: Dave presents his OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE of global flood, no badgering!
Reply #14
Because I do not see how it can be considered evidence of a flood at all.
Nor do I.
Hawkins: see if you can explain why it is, without resorting to your usual bluster/bravado insults.
"I understand Donald Trump better than many people because I really am a lot like him." - Dave Hawkins

Re: Dave presents his OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE of global flood, no badgering!
Reply #15
The reason being, of course, that if that sandstone layer is a flood layer, then the ones above it must also be floodlayers, or laid down in the mere 6000 years after. If floodlayers, deposited in a single year, they should be equally global, or at least we need an explanation why some of them are as widespread, and others are not.

We also need an explanation for the distribution of fossils in distinct layers both vertically and horizontally. Why do we find them sorted like that, into neat biological communities, with one community sitting on top of the other?

A global flood as an explanation for the Tapeats creates more difficulties and questions than answers.

  • Pingu
Re: Dave presents his OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE of global flood, no badgering!
Reply #16
The reason being, of course, that if that sandstone layer is a flood layer, then the ones above it must also be floodlayers, or laid down in the mere 6000 years after. If floodlayers, deposited in a single year, they should be equally global, or at least we need an explanation why some of them are as widespread, and others are not.

We also need an explanation for the distribution of fossils in distinct layers both vertically and horizontally. Why do we find them sorted like that, into neat biological communities, with one community sitting on top of the other?

A global flood as an explanation for the Tapeats creates more difficulties and questions than answers.

He has already been shown that "that sandstone layer" is NOT a single layer,  nor is it "incredibly thin".  He's just going on some stupid graphic some YEC posted that tried to show a single sandstone level covering much of North America..

For Dave, a graphic is "evidence", just as someone's opinion about the Sahara is "evidence".  Or is if it supports his preferred conclusion.

I have a Darwin-debased mind.

  • Zombies!
  • These violent delights have violent ends.
Re: Dave presents his OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE of global flood, no badgering!
Reply #17
I've posted evidence for the Flood many times before ... some examples better than others ...

Here's one of my all time favorites ...

The sandstone layer that includes the Tapeats but has many different names all across North America ... I was first made aware of the remarkable nature of this sandstone layer by Bill Hoesch of ICR ... https://www.icr.org/article/3342/ ...

This layer is enormous ... covering a majority of the land area of the N. Am continent ...

Also it's incredibly flat ...

And it's incredibly thin ...

There is no process occurring today which could possibly create anything remotely close to such a layer.  (No the Bahamas doesn't cut it)

While you cannot look at this layer by itself and conclude "Global Flood" ... you CAN look at it and conclude ... "Gigantic continent sized hydraulic cataclysm the likes of which has never been equalled in all of recorded history."

From that conclusion, it's only a small step, employing other evidence, to "Global Flood"

You're welcome.
So, nothing?
I really should call your department head and tell him or her how badly you are behaving while posing as a credentialed professional scientist.

Re: Dave presents his OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE of global flood, no badgering!
Reply #18
So are we to assume that all the layers above that sandstone where also in the same global ocean at the same time, and that all of them were deposited in a single year? How did that work? That is a truly *astonishing* amount of material that has to be deposited, AND be somehow compressed and turned to the various types of rock, AND sorted into discrete layers... with the fossils grouped into biological communities!

I mean - the mind boggles at the kind of explanations that would be required for all of that.

Re: Dave presents his OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE of global flood, no badgering!
Reply #19
MEGASEQUENCES

That's what we are really talking about here ... and to dig deep into megasequences, we need to consult Laurence Sloss ... here's a nice little PDF with some background on his work ...

Note especially the following paragraphs ...
Quote
SEISMIC SEQUENCE STRATIGRAPHY
In the late 1960s, Sloss and Dapples had several exceptional
students, notably Peter Vail, Robert Mitchum, and John Sangree,
who completed dissertations involving Pennsylvanian strata. They
became aware that glacial eustatic changes of sea level could have
been responsible for the numerous widespread unconformities in
the famous cyclothems. Following receipt of their degrees, these
men joined an Exxon research group, which was to develop
modern seismic stratigraphy. They adopted and greatly refined
their mentors' sequence stratigraphy to the interpretation of
subsurface seismic data. They recognized similar successions of
sequences and unconformities on different, widely separated
continental margins, which implied some global cause, perhaps
glacial eustatic fluctuations.

...

In 1984, Sloss had this to say about his intellectual children:
"This group was pre-adapted to recognize unconformity-bounded
units on reflection seismic records and they are deeply impressed
by the apparent global synchrony of stratigraphic patterns clearly
related to the freeboard of continental margins.
... They find that
they sleep well when they place their faith in eustatic sea levels and
dream pleasant dreams when glacial controls on eustatics can be
invoked" (p. 9-10).

http://www.geosociety.org/gsatoday/archive/24/3/pdf/i1052-5173-24-3-26.pdf

Re: Dave presents his OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE of global flood, no badgering!
Reply #20
Then in 1988, Sloss had this to say ...
Quote
Meanwhile, it is worth considering the proposition that sea level change is a second- or third-order response to some more significant global phenomenon.

https://pubs.geoscienceworld.org/gsa/gsabulletin/article-abstract/100/11/1661/182040/forty-years-of-sequence-stratigraphy?redirectedFrom=fulltext

Gee I wonder what this "more significant global phenomenon" could be!

Love to read this entire paper.

Re: Dave presents his OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE of global flood, no badgering!
Reply #21
LOL Dave. Did you actually read the article?

Re: Dave presents his OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE of global flood, no badgering!
Reply #22
MEGASEQUENCES

That's what we are really talking about here ... and to dig deep into megasequences, we need to consult Laurence Sloss ... here's a nice little PDF with some background on his work ...

Note especially the following paragraphs ...
Quote
SEISMIC SEQUENCE STRATIGRAPHY
In the late 1960s, Sloss and Dapples had several exceptional
students, notably Peter Vail, Robert Mitchum, and John Sangree,
who completed dissertations involving Pennsylvanian strata. They
became aware that glacial eustatic changes of sea level could have
been responsible for the numerous widespread unconformities in
the famous cyclothems. Following receipt of their degrees, these
men joined an Exxon research group, which was to develop
modern seismic stratigraphy. They adopted and greatly refined
their mentors' sequence stratigraphy to the interpretation of
subsurface seismic data. They recognized similar successions of
sequences and unconformities on different, widely separated
continental margins, which implied some global cause, perhaps
glacial eustatic fluctuations.

...

In 1984, Sloss had this to say about his intellectual children:
"This group was pre-adapted to recognize unconformity-bounded
units on reflection seismic records and they are deeply impressed
by the apparent global synchrony of stratigraphic patterns clearly
related to the freeboard of continental margins.
... They find that
they sleep well when they place their faith in eustatic sea levels and
dream pleasant dreams when glacial controls on eustatics can be
invoked" (p. 9-10).

http://www.geosociety.org/gsatoday/archive/24/3/pdf/i1052-5173-24-3-26.pdf

Dave, how is this article supposed to support your position?

Re: Dave presents his OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE of global flood, no badgering!
Reply #23
Here's a creationist paper on the topic ... https://creation.com/images/pdfs/tj/j09_2/j09_2_223-243.pdf

In this paper, Glenn Morton is quoted as saying ...
Quote
One
of Morton's conclusions was 'that since global systems of
rock deposition exist, the deposition of the geologic column
must be globally controlled.'
44

Interesting.  Lots to digest in this paper. 

  • Zombies!
  • These violent delights have violent ends.
Re: Dave presents his OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE of global flood, no badgering!
Reply #24
Here's a creationist paper on the topic ... https://creation.com/images/pdfs/tj/j09_2/j09_2_223-243.pdf

In this paper, Glenn Morton is quoted as saying ...
Quote
One
of Morton's conclusions was 'that since global systems of
rock deposition exist, the deposition of the geologic column
must be globally controlled.'
44

Interesting.  Lots to digest in this paper.
Can we jump to the OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE?
I really should call your department head and tell him or her how badly you are behaving while posing as a credentialed professional scientist.