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  • TalkRational: Do you have to allow so much swearing and name calling on your website? Is it really necessary? I came by this web site by asking a Bargain Hunt question and was surprised that such a family, morning TV programme has cause for such mindless profanities. It makes one ask why watch the programme then?

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Messages - BenTheBiased

1
There are millions of species that live in the rainforest, Dave. Cutting down the trees would be destroying their habitat. How many species do you think are going to live in the pasture you replace it with?
2
Kill microorganisms in the soil. Kill brain cells. Kill unborn babies. Let's see... What else can we kill?
Trees?
a few, yes. But in their place many other things will grow.
Not nearly as any as you'd be killing by getting rid of the trees.
lots more actually.
You know the trees aren't the only things that live in the rainforest right? It's a whole complex ecology. And you think you can just reduce it by 50% and replace that with pasture land and the rest will still be just fine? For all your talk of holistic thinking, you really are incapable of it.
3
Kill microorganisms in the soil. Kill brain cells. Kill unborn babies. Let's see... What else can we kill?
Trees?
a few, yes. But in their place many other things will grow.
Not nearly as many as you'd be killing by getting rid of the trees.
4
Kill microorganisms in the soil. Kill brain cells. Kill unborn babies. Let's see... What else can we kill?
Everything that lives in any climate different from Missouri's?
5
Kill microorganisms in the soil. Kill brain cells. Kill unborn babies. Let's see... What else can we kill?
Trees?
6
Quote
But I'm not sure if anyone here cares about this interesting scientific stuff

Quote
I don't bother reading such studies because they don't pertain to what I'm doing.
this would make sense to you if you could get it through your thick skull that the great science going on these days is not in the mainstream. It's happening on Little Farms here and there and once in awhile there's someone with a Ph.D like Elaine Ingham that gets her head screwed on straight and helps out.
It makes even more sense when you "get it through your thick skull" that "great science" means "anything Dave thinks supports his beliefs" (and "get it through your thick skull" means "agree with Dave").
7
LOL. That pesky knowledge really gets in the way of the indoctrination, eh Dave? You're wrong though. The real thing most people here learned in school and college that prevents them from swallowing your bullshit is how to think critically.
this group has no idea how to think critically. I've never seen such groupthink in my life.
Agreement isn't groupthink. Nor is disagreement critical thinking.
8
LOL. That pesky knowledge really gets in the way of the indoctrination, eh Dave? You're wrong though. The real thing most people here learned in school and college that prevents them from swallowing your bullshit is how to think critically.
9
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
you think elephants don't knock down trees? You think dinosaurs, many of which were much larger than elephants didn't knock down trees when they roamed the Earth?
Yeah I'm sure they routinely cleared 50% of any given rainforest.  ::)
In nice neat swaths that easily converted to pasture no less.

I do like this new idea that taking anything any animal has ever done and systematically reproducing it on a larger scale constitutes "mimicking nature" though. You know dolphins have been known to torture porpoises, so the next time the government is looking for a justification for torture you can always tell them they're just "mimicking nature."
10
The whole fucking enchilada with HMG is to mimic Nature's designs, a great example of which is found in the rainforest.

Why the fuck do you think HMG ranchers don't have to apply bagged fertilizers to make their pastures super productive, so productive that they can support two and three times the conventional stocking rates?

It's because they are following Nature's designs, a great example of which can be found in the rainforest.

Good Lord, you people are so brainwashed it's pathetic!
Nature's design for rainforests is for them to be forest, Dave, not pasture. Cutting down the trees to convert rainforest to pasture is not in any way mimicking nature's design.
it is really mind-blowing that you guys cannot connect the dots with this stuff. I guess it comes down to the brainwashing. The fertilizer sales establishment must be extremely powerful indeed.
Is this one of those times where you knew you had no counter to my point so you just decided to say whatever random nonsense popped into your head? Because that's what it looks like.
no it's just that every so often my head explodes from the ineptness.

The answer to your question is really simple. Dave Hawkins cutting down a few trees in the rainforest is not much different than elephants or dinosaurs knocking them down in the past. So yes I'm mimicking nature.
Ahahahahaha! Wow. You really come up with the dumbest shit in service of your fantasies.
you think elephants don't knock down trees? You think dinosaurs, many of which were much larger than elephants didn't knock down trees when they roamed the Earth?
Yeah I'm sure they routinely cleared 50% of any given rainforest.  ::)
11
That seems like the next natural step. There was never really much thought there to begin with.
12
But hey, cities aren't all that different from ant colonies, so it's still "mimicking nature" right?
13
If that's really as creative as you can be then you've got some serious questions to ask yourself

For one thing, if you really believe that, then you really do not believe that the Wai Wai people should be eating cassava.  Because cutting down rainforests is exactly what they do in order to plant cassava. So if you are consistent with your own position, then you should campaign against them doing that.

Secondly, you should never be in favor of any of the other Wai Wai people moving over to Guyana to live in their one and a half million acre Conservation District to be near their relatives because they too will use slash-and-burn agriculture to grow cassava.

Thirdly, you should actively oppose all indigenous groups that use slash and burn agriculture to grow cassava and instead at have them all move to the cities so that they can be fed by megafarms who instead of doing small scale slash and burn, will bring their giant bulldozer and tractors. 

Then all these people can live happily ever after in their big cities and they can all get Advanced degrees and achieve world peace through industrial agriculture.
Hey moron, you're the one who bloviates about "mimicking nature," not me.
14
The whole fucking enchilada with HMG is to mimic Nature's designs, a great example of which is found in the rainforest.

Why the fuck do you think HMG ranchers don't have to apply bagged fertilizers to make their pastures super productive, so productive that they can support two and three times the conventional stocking rates?

It's because they are following Nature's designs, a great example of which can be found in the rainforest.

Good Lord, you people are so brainwashed it's pathetic!
Nature's design for rainforests is for them to be forest, Dave, not pasture. Cutting down the trees to convert rainforest to pasture is not in any way mimicking nature's design.
it is really mind-blowing that you guys cannot connect the dots with this stuff. I guess it comes down to the brainwashing. The fertilizer sales establishment must be extremely powerful indeed.
Is this one of those times where you knew you had no counter to my point so you just decided to say whatever random nonsense popped into your head? Because that's what it looks like.
no it's just that every so often my head explodes from the ineptness.

The answer to your question is really simple. Dave Hawkins cutting down a few trees in the rainforest is not much different than elephants or dinosaurs knocking them down in the past. So yes I'm mimicking nature.
Ahahahahaha! Wow. You really come up with the dumbest shit in service of your fantasies.
16
The whole fucking enchilada with HMG is to mimic Nature's designs, a great example of which is found in the rainforest.

Why the fuck do you think HMG ranchers don't have to apply bagged fertilizers to make their pastures super productive, so productive that they can support two and three times the conventional stocking rates?

It's because they are following Nature's designs, a great example of which can be found in the rainforest.

Good Lord, you people are so brainwashed it's pathetic!
Nature's design for rainforests is for them to be forest, Dave, not pasture. Cutting down the trees to convert rainforest to pasture is not in any way mimicking nature's design.
it is really mind-blowing that you guys cannot connect the dots with this stuff. I guess it comes down to the brainwashing. The fertilizer sales establishment must be extremely powerful indeed.
Is this one of those times where you knew you had no counter to my point so you just decided to say whatever random nonsense popped into your head? Because that's what it looks like.
17
LOL. Wow. Just noticed the same thing in the cart thread. Heinz really can't remember what's being discussed for very long.
18
A motor that's making the belt go sideways. Not up and down.

The cart.
Nice to see your usual level of coherence in this post.

Not clear? It is the cart that moves up and down, not the belt.

It does so because of the reaction force from the belt, when the belt delivers power to the wheels, which I explained earlier.

There is not a similar reaction force from rolling on the ground. The ground does not deliver any power to the wheels in any reference frame despite what the crackpots say.
Wow. I think I finally understand part of your issues. You're amazingly bad at following a discussion. That kind of memory issue can really hinder learning. Anyway, to remind you, even though it's still on the same page, here's the context of my comment that the motor makes the belt go sideways rather than up and down...
Well I did say "apparently." But you do keep comparing the wheel resting on the treadmill to a pulley. For example, here:
In fact, any wheel deformation will make it much more difficult for the belt to spin the wheel.


Why?

Try spinning a brick with a belt and see for yourself.

Engineers go to great lengths to see that pulleys are as round as possible and usually made of rigid metal.

Pulley deformation is unwanted. Can you even guess why?
And you also have said...
Initially, the cart is held down on the belt, to get the wheels and propeller spinning, and the act of holding the cart down overcomes the reaction force. But, once the cart is released, the reaction force will push the wheels away from the belt, causing a loss of traction.
 With reduced traction, propeller thrust briefly exceeds wheel brake force and the cart can advance on the belt. But, whatever goes up must come back down, and the wheels will once again make contact, briefly, with the belt and the cart regains some or all of the energy used in the brief advance up the belt. This results in a cyclic action of the cart periodically advancing during reduction in wheel drag and periodically regaining traction and recovering energy.
That certainly sounds like a perpetual-motion trampoline. Why wouldn't it eventually stop losing traction?

And as far as the part about it functioning as a moving surface, you sure don't seem eager to analyze it as such.

How is it perpetual motion when it is all driven by a motor on the treadmill?

A motor that's making the belt go sideways. Not up and down.
As you can see, the question was why the cart doesn't eventually stop losing traction. Telling me that it's the cart moving up and down and not the belt doesn't explain why it doesn't eventually stop doing so. In reality of course, it would stop doing so almost immediately, if there even was any noticeable up/down movement, which there very likely is none.
19
A motor that's making the belt go sideways. Not up and down.

The cart.
Nice to see your usual level of coherence in this post.
21
When he first started talking about opening up the canopy 50% or whatever, was he talking about cutting down every other tree? Or is that just what I was picturing? Has it always been about these stripes? I'm not sure which is worse, but I feel like probably the stripes are. I feel like the rainforest would have a chance at recovery if it was what I was originally picturing. Not so much with the stripes.
22
I kinda wonder how much of this comes back to Dave's idiotic notion that the amount of vegetation in an area controls the amount of rainfall. Like does he think if you cut down a certain amount of trees in the rainforest, the amount of rainfall will drop to Missouri levels?
23
The whole fucking enchilada with HMG is to mimic Nature's designs, a great example of which is found in the rainforest.

Why the fuck do you think HMG ranchers don't have to apply bagged fertilizers to make their pastures super productive, so productive that they can support two and three times the conventional stocking rates?

It's because they are following Nature's designs, a great example of which can be found in the rainforest.

Good Lord, you people are so brainwashed it's pathetic!
Nature's design for rainforests is for them to be forest, Dave, not pasture. Cutting down the trees to convert rainforest to pasture is not in any way mimicking nature's design.
24
I'm pretty sure that the answer to my question has nothing to do with the types of plants because there are a zillion different types of plants in the rainforest. I'm pretty sure it has something to do with the healthy soil.
You really think it's just totally random that certain plants happen to grow in certain environments, don't you? Or does that even cross your mind?
Logic fail
Yeah, that's what I was pointing out.
25
I'm pretty sure that the answer to my question has nothing to do with the types of plants because there are a zillion different types of plants in the rainforest. I'm pretty sure it has something to do with the healthy soil.
You really think it's just totally random that certain plants happen to grow in certain environments, don't you? Or does that even cross your mind?