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  • TalkRational: it's as if at least two distinct groups of people who have diametrically opposed points of view with completely incompatible underlying assumptions are having an argument. Oh, and for added fun, everyone here seems to believe that everyone else is a disingenuous prick or a complete retard.

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Messages - arpie

Science / Re: Direct Down Wind Faster Than The Wind
Thanks for the reminder, spork. For while I've likely watched this video at least a dozen times over the last 5 years, I'd forgotten it along with so much else. Looking forward to reading Heinz's response.
Science / Re: Direct Down Wind Faster Than The Wind
So very glad to see you back, Heinz. Will have a lot to say anon, but I stopped reading at page 37 as it's late. Just a quick question.

Have you seen ridgerunner's latest small cart? He said over a year ago he was going to show it outrunning smoke. Seems this is the right time for steady winds where he wants to test, but I suspect we will never see it. RR??

I used to get notified if anyone posted here, but it didn't this time. Really looking forward to catching up tomorrow. Find it hilarious that as with humber, so many bright people here are trying to dismiss as a fool someone who clearly has elements of genius. Not making any judgement on the validity of either's claims, but certainly much has been adroitly presented. 
Science / Re: Direct Down Wind Faster Than The Wind
@RidgeRunner: Hope you're getting set for running your tests in the steady winds of September there in Utah. I'm really looking forward to seeing your TM cart outrun the packing foam, smoke, or whatever.
Science / Re: Direct Down Wind Faster Than The Wind
Been waiting nearly a month now for Grins or Spork to answer your question above, FX. Makes me wonder if you have them stumped. In our brave new, post-truth reality, I'm awed that some remain so certain they are right about the outcomes of tests never run, like the cart on a much longer belt.
The Aeolus carts have a hard time because they have to carry a 100+ lb meat sack (which has been explained to you before...)

I know it has but I still don't fully buy it. But I will if I see it done. You still in same location? If yes then fall is best time for wind, yes?? Glad to see you checked in RR, and really hope you can show me I'm wrong soon.  ETA-I forgot to mention BB was also carrying meat yet look at the difference the larger prop made.

@FX-dude, ffs just look ahead of that page to where humber starts posting daily again and see how dramatic the change was. And it kept going. Do I really need to show you the fucking numbers??
If humber was just trolling..quite possible..then I was his biggest success wrt time wasted in emails trying to get him to answer some key questions. I really had hoped he'd see it in time. But the fact he just dropped out without any apologies or further rebuttals I found quite disappointing.

But here's the problem. There is no doubt in my dissembling mind that humber, Harold, and Heinz are all far more intelligent than I am. They know more about the physics involved in this epic thread. So it long troubled me that there wasn't a total consensus on what to me had appeared as a no-brainer. A sailboat can't use leverage as BB did. I couldn't begin to lift my truck, but with a jack I can.

That humber was a master at presenting multiple arguments minutes apart, to me is obvious. And tbh it was part of my doubt. That such a bright, informed group of people that I witnessed making long rebuttals to his claims, made me wonder why they would bother.  Going back to JREF in '07 and onto RDF. When humber was banned there, the thread died. When spork started it here, after a few months of Harold getting involved it was again dying until humber returned. Then it soared to 110 pages from the thirties before he came back, in just 6 days. It ended with over 5k pages just here.

@ridgerunner -Still hoping you will do those long promised videos of your latest cart exceeding wind speed. Yours is the most advanced TM testable cart I'm aware of, and I still have some doubt if the much smaller blade and loss of traction won't make any difference. This is especially true given how long it took the many universities participating in the Aeolus runs to just achieve wind speed. The differential in prop size between those carts and BB is far less than that of any TM capable cart I'm guessing, but would love to see proof I'm wrong.
You have to admit Humber was far more interesting and intelligent than our current pres. Strange times indeed.

I certainly wouldn't admit that.  Both of them are extremely interesting in a train-wreck sense.  And both are unbelievably stupid.  Although I think humber might edge Trump out on this count.

Spork, I really think you are letting personal feelings blind your judgement here. Have you watched Trump speaking?? This was a long physics debate. Trump can't even keep simple facts straight, and has contradicted past statements countless times.

Hi to tober, Cored, and Semper. Any new discussions lately? Sad how social media has replaced message boards. :(
Great to hear it, WG. Hope you know you are in my top 5 all time favorite posters. Sad all the message boards are pretty much gone. Like this one, where 'forever' is a day long. Have to log in every time I come here even though I clicked the 'forever' option wrt logging in.

So where are you 'hangin' online these days? Any interesting discussions? I mostly read news feeds on FB now. The Trump debacle. You have to admit Humber was far more interesting and intelligent than our current pres. Strange times indeed.
Whoa! The prodigal son has returned.  :ohmy:  How's tricks, JB? What are you up to these days? Where are you?

FWIW I now realize just how dumb many of my minor reservations about the concept of ddw,, were. and apologize for feeding the trolls. I'm nowhere within the range of your intelligence, but then the same applies to Kammen and Humber so I sometimes have to rely on instinct. You'll be pleased to know I've learned the virtue of silence for those in range of dementia.

Truly hope this finds you well and working on your next reversal of aerodynamic folklore. -RCP

I'm half way to 74 ol pal. Can you top that? My guess is you're in your early fifties. Just wait. It never gets better, and you're years away from the real impact of dementia. Remember I warned ya when you get there. :colbert:
Hey man I didn't realize you were RP.
You must be getting old, FX. I mean, RP/Ar-pie? Are you on Facebook? If yes send me your name in a PM.
Thanks Mike. Most in the group as Hesse pointed ended up dying of natural causes. I've often viewed it as an 'escape button' in case things get really bad. Never understood why some hang on in appalling conditions.

Wrote a poem on my feelings many years ago, and when I posted it online decades later it was picked up by a zine. Here's a link:

Was in touch with the man who started this thread recently, the one behind Blackbird; spork. I'll always be grateful to him for beginning and ending this epic thread. Sad to see it ended, but it was definitely the most fun ride I've had in the cyberverse.

If any of the old timers here look in, do at least say hi. If only Humber would return, right FX?
Thanks for the summary FX. Sadly it didn't bring back a coherent memory of the novel. The list of those I do remember well is now much smaller than the many plots forgotten. What I was referring to was in the first chapter or possibly even in prologue. It concerned a group Hesse called the 'suicidas' that really registered with me. But with enough time, all is slowly forgotten.  :smith:
Science / Re: Direct Down Wind Faster Than The Wind
Suicidal, Valor. :stareicide:
Suicidal, Valor. :stareicide:

It comes and goes. I'm one of the 'suicides' from Hesse's "Stppenwolf."

Science / Re: Direct Down Wind Faster Than The Wind
Suicidal, Valor. And you?  :stareicide:
Science / Re: Direct Down Wind Faster Than The Wind
Hey CORed. I see some of the old gang is still around. Anyone seen Windgrins? RidgeRuner?

After 20 years on the net I still hold this thread as the most entertaining I've ever encountered. Any of you folks on FaceBook? I spend most of my time now reading news feeds there and a few folks I follow who generate interesting discussions. One is John Freestone, for those who go back to JREF and RDF. Here he was Liberated Rock Chick iirc, and we've stayed int touch via voice mails.

Sad to see the message boards all decline, and have a lot of theories on why. Would enjoy reading any thoughts on this subject. Hope all of those who made this thread so informative are doing well, and drop in to say hi on occasion.
Science / Re: Direct Down Wind Faster Than The Wind
So you guys found another denier? Wonder what Humber is up to these days? And will RR finally do his long promised test runs of his latest cart this fall?

To show how naive I was I actually believed at some point Humber and the 2 others who's names I've forgotten..Harold something and the later guy...would finally get it after I posted that letter from the guy in charge of the AP test saying none of the teachers had challenged question 11 on that test in 2014, How could they all miss the difference gearing could make? Never understood that one.

Oh well, we now live in a 'post reality' world and maybe Humber was a prophet preparing us for Trump. Such is life..
Science / Re: Direct Down Wind Faster Than The Wind
Bump, just in case some carters drop in and can't find this thread, as just happened to me. Hi guys. Hope you all had a merry Christmyth.
Science / Re: Direct Down Wind Faster Than The Wind
Wow, RR. That's what you said 2 years ago. We're talking about 1 day to do the test, a couple more to plan it.  :(
Science / Re: Direct Down Wind Faster Than The Wind
@ridgerunner: Heh, I obviously meant to say 'fall' is here' above.  Was reading a post elsewhere by a South African welcoming spring just before and thus the time frame switch.  But please do let us know if you are still planning to do the video showing your cart outrunning smoke or balloons? It would be a first, so I truly hope you'll do it while the winds are still steady there.
Science / Re: Direct Down Wind Faster Than The Wind
They were good for a few chuckles.

They were good for much more than that, imho. They fueled the discussion, and engendered many interesting segues. What is there really to discuss now? Preaching to the choir gets old quickly.

But I signed on here just to see RR's long promised video of his small cart exceeding ws. Spring is again here RR, when you get those consistent winds up in Utah. I'm still short of being convinced the much smaller prop could achieve what BB's 17 footer did. Seeing is believing for me. You put a lot of time into that cart. Show us what it can do!!

And speaking of seeing, I heard from our old pal Mac G. yesterday, who's team not only won the Aeolus competition this year, but they finally went faster than the wind. Thought I'd share the video he sent.

"Heres a nice video of one of the fast runs (notice to other car we pass as well as the struggling cyclist J)

-Mac G