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Topic: Yi qi / Gotta love this (Read 310 times) previous topic - next topic

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  • socrates1
Yi qi / Gotta love this
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yi_(dinosaur)
Yi qi, and presumably other scansoriopterygids, possessed a type of wing unknown among any other [dinosaur] prehistoric bird  relatives. Unlike other paravian dinosaurs, they seem to have replaced bird-like feathers with membranous wings, in what may have been one of many independent evolutionary experiments with flight close to the origin of birds.[1]

A variant of the bat model might be the "pterosaur model" in which the styliform bone would have been directed obliquely to the outside, with a narrower wing as a result.

Other vertebrate fossils found in the same rock quarry as Yi qi, which would have been close contemporaries, included salamanders like Chunerpeton tianyiensis, the flying pterosaurs Changchengopterus pani, Dendrorhynchoides mutoudengensis, and Qinglongopterus guoi, as well as the early tree-dwelling mammal species Arboroharamiya jenkinsi.[1]
  • Last Edit: June 13, 2017, 06:55:59 AM by socrates1

  • VoxRat
  • wtactualf
Re: Yi qi
Reply #1
What "Socrates" left out of his c&p from wikipedia:

Quote
The only known specimen of Yi qi preserved a heavy covering of feathers. Unusually, based on its classification as an advanced theropod in the clade Pennaraptora (a group containing theropods with advanced, bird-like feathers), the feathers were all very simple in structure and "paintbrush-like", with long quill-like bases topped by sprays of thinner filaments. All these structures were rather stiff.[1] The feathers covered most of the body, starting near the tip of the snout. The head and neck feathers were long and formed a thick coat, and the body feathers were even longer and denser, making it difficult for scientists to study their detailed structure. The longest feathers, with a length of about six centimetres, were present behind the upper arm and the shinbone. The metatarsus of the foot had a feather covering also.[1]
"I understand Donald Trump better than many people because I really am a lot like him." - Dave Hawkins

  • nesb
Re: Yi qi
Reply #2
Quote mining. Not even once.

  • socrates1
Re: Yi qi
Reply #3
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yi_(dinosaur)
Yi qi, and presumably other scansoriopterygids, possessed a type of wing unknown among any other [dinosaur] prehistoric bird  relatives. Unlike other paravian dinosaurs, they seem to have replaced bird-like feathers with membranous wings, in what may have been one of many independent evolutionary experiments with flight close to the origin of birds.[1]

A variant of the bat model might be the "pterosaur model" in which the styliform bone would have been directed obliquely to the outside, with a narrower wing as a result.

Other vertebrate fossils found in the same rock quarry as Yi qi, which would have been close contemporaries, included salamanders like Chunerpeton tianyiensis, the flying pterosaurs Changchengopterus pani, Dendrorhynchoides mutoudengensis, and Qinglongopterus guoi, as well as the early tree-dwelling mammal species Arboroharamiya jenkinsi.[1]

If people are interested in this subject just move it back to Science section. If not, so be it.

  • socrates1
Yi qi (II)
Reply #4
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25924069
The wings of birds and their closest theropod relatives share a uniform fundamental architecture, with pinnate flight feathers as the key component. Here we report a new scansoriopterygid theropod, Yi qi gen. et sp. nov., based on a new specimen from the Middle-Upper Jurassic period Tiaojishan Formation of Hebei Province, China. Yi is nested phylogenetically among winged theropods but has large stiff filamentous feathers of an unusual type on both the forelimb and hindlimb. However, the filamentous feathers of Yi resemble pinnate feathers in bearing morphologically diverse melanosomes. Most surprisingly, Yi has a long rod-like bone extending from each wrist, and patches of membranous tissue preserved between the rod-like bones and the manual digits. Analogous features are unknown in any dinosaur but occur in various flying and gliding tetrapods, suggesting the intriguing possibility that Yi had membranous aerodynamic surfaces totally different from the archetypal feathered wings of birds and their closest relatives.
Documentation of the unique forelimbs of Yi greatly increases the morphological disparity known to exist among dinosaurs, and highlights the extraordinary breadth and richness of the evolutionary experimentation that took place close to the origin of birds.

I am not convinced that they have interpreted Yi qi correctly. But if they have, it is wonderful evidence of a link between pterosaurs and basal Paraves. It is hard to imagine better evidence.

  • VoxRat
  • wtactualf
Re: Yi qi (II)
Reply #5
I can imagine better evidence.
Like, for instance, if the skeleton of Yi remotely resembled that of any pterosaur.
"I understand Donald Trump better than many people because I really am a lot like him." - Dave Hawkins

  • Faid
Re: Yi qi (II)
Reply #6
End of the line?
Who even made the rule that we cannot group ducks and fish together for the simple reason that they are both aquatic? If I want to group them that way and it serves my purpose then I can jolly well do it however I want to and it is still a nested hierarchy and you can't tell me that it's not.

  • socrates1
Re: Yi qi (II)
Reply #7
https://www.nature.com/articles/nature14423.epdf?referrer_access_token=aXP0rMThuriYuvLDytsEU9RgN0jAjWel9jnR3ZoTv0PSoBPtAJS-K6Ofmq0_6wDOhsGY0rj_zJ_eQ8W9B9wsxLSCf2nbgU8Z-z5IJJQdfB_oT5rHGSjgUyjywdd61kg7z3GhdN-kkEBzDhZufuyKopWSgg-qEOLwE4c30ePqEJaqrjmI76uW5HZhMvNHypY7KJVZOa4ZNNYps69ieswFrXO4wDINm3UKCLxElIB4H4o%3D&tracking_referrer=www.nature.com
The highly elongated manual digit IV of Yi and other scansoriopterygids is unique among theropods but superficially similar to the long manual digits II-V of bats and the highly elongated fourth finger in pterosaurs.


I am not convinced that they have interpreted Yi qi correctly. But if they have, it is wonderful evidence of a link between pterosaurs and basal Paraves. It is hard to imagine better evidence.

  • Faid
Re: Yi qi
Reply #8
So be it.

Bye.
Who even made the rule that we cannot group ducks and fish together for the simple reason that they are both aquatic? If I want to group them that way and it serves my purpose then I can jolly well do it however I want to and it is still a nested hierarchy and you can't tell me that it's not.

  • nesb
Re: Yi qi (II)
Reply #9
Sock. ARSE exists to discuss or propose non-mainstream takes on scientific issues*. It's got a funny name, but that is where these pterosaur-to-bird posts belong.

*but actually for Dave to post whatever he wants

  • VoxRat
  • wtactualf
Re: Yi qi (II)
Reply #10
It is hard to imagine better evidence.
I can imagine better evidence.
See above.
"I understand Donald Trump better than many people because I really am a lot like him." - Dave Hawkins

  • socrates1
Re: Yi qi (II)
Reply #11
https://www.nature.com/article-assets/npg/nature/journal/v521/n7550/extref/nature14423-s1.pdf
If a membrane is reconstructed lateral to the trunk, the wing is similar in outline to a bat wing if the styliform element is
approximately posteriorly oriented (Extended Data Fig. 9a), or to a pterosaur wing if the
styliform element is approximately laterally oriented
(not shown in Extended Data Fig.
9).


I am not convinced that they have interpreted Yi qi correctly. But if they have, it is wonderful evidence of a link between pterosaurs and basal Paraves. It is hard to imagine better evidence.
  • Last Edit: June 13, 2017, 09:40:00 AM by socrates1

  • Faid
Re: Yi qi (II)
Reply #12
End of the line.
Who even made the rule that we cannot group ducks and fish together for the simple reason that they are both aquatic? If I want to group them that way and it serves my purpose then I can jolly well do it however I want to and it is still a nested hierarchy and you can't tell me that it's not.

  • socrates1
Re: Yi qi (II)
Reply #13
If people are interested in this subject just move it back to Science section. If not, so be it.

I am not convinced that they have interpreted Yi qi correctly. But if they have, it is wonderful evidence of a link between pterosaurs and basal Paraves. It is hard to imagine better evidence.


  • VoxRat
  • wtactualf
Re: Yi qi (II)
Reply #14
I am not convinced that they have interpreted Yi qi correctly. But if they have, it is wonderful evidence of a link between pterosaurs and basal Paraves. It is hard to imagine better evidence.
I can imagine better evidence.
See above.
"I understand Donald Trump better than many people because I really am a lot like him." - Dave Hawkins

  • VoxRat
  • wtactualf
Re: Yi qi (II)
Reply #15
This is all I intend to say on this topic.
"I understand Donald Trump better than many people because I really am a lot like him." - Dave Hawkins

  • socrates1
Gotta love this
Reply #16
https://www.sciencenews.org/article/dinosaur%E2%80%99s-ride-may-have-been-glide
A dinosaur called Yi qi appears to have lifted a page from pterosaurs' flight plan. Protruding from each of the newly discovered dinosaur's wrists was a weird rodlike bone that may have attached to a fleshy wing that helped the dinosaur glide or fly, researchers report April 29 in Nature."We've never seen anything like this in a dinosaur before," says paleontologist Sarah Werning of Stony Brook University in New York. "It's almost like this dinosaur [basal Paraves] was pretending to be a pterosaur."

This is refreshing honesty.


  • Last Edit: June 13, 2017, 10:08:43 AM by socrates1

Re: Yi qi
Reply #17
If people are interested in this subject just move it back to Science section. If not, so be it.

I am not convinced that they have interpreted Yi qi correctly. But if they have, it is wonderful evidence of a link between pterosaurs and basal Paraves. It is hard to imagine better evidence.
Clearly better evidence is very easy to imagine. The guests are quite disappointed in you.

  • Doobie Keebler
  • Ridiculous Callipygous
Re: Yi qi / Gotta love this
Reply #18
https://www.nature.com/article-assets/npg/nature/journal/v521/n7550/extref/nature14423-s1.pdf
If a membrane is reconstructed lateral to the trunk, the wing is similar in outline to a bat wing if the styliform element is
approximately posteriorly oriented (Extended Data Fig. 9a), or to a pterosaur wing if the
styliform element is approximately laterally oriented
(not shown in Extended Data Fig.
9).


I am not convinced that they have interpreted Yi qi correctly. But if they have, it is wonderful evidence of a link between pterosaurs and basal Paraves. It is hard to imagine better evidence.

Based on cherry-picking the preferred IFs, hinging on a selectively chosen analogous OR,  all of which is only in reference to describing the possible "similar outline" and nothing more, and coming from someone who has never so much as handled a relevant fossil let alone competently examined it detail.

It's hard to imagine a more stunning development in the science of bird evolution.  :awgee:
"I'm over 70 and have never seen such , arrogance, incompetence and Ill -intentions as this President and his aids."    The Dotard     (posted 12 days after his 68th birthday)

  • Peez
Re: Yi qi / Gotta love this
Reply #19
Quote
socrates1:
It is hard to imagine better evidence.
Actually it is very easy to imagine better evidence, but I can accept that you cannot imagine better evidence.

Peez

  • Faid
Re: Yi qi / Gotta love this
Reply #20
He's just pretending to misunderstand. We accept his apology.
Who even made the rule that we cannot group ducks and fish together for the simple reason that they are both aquatic? If I want to group them that way and it serves my purpose then I can jolly well do it however I want to and it is still a nested hierarchy and you can't tell me that it's not.

  • VoxRat
  • wtactualf
Re: Yi qi / Gotta love this
Reply #21
Check out the comments on Ed Yong's blog here:rofl:
"I understand Donald Trump better than many people because I really am a lot like him." - Dave Hawkins

  • nesb
Re: Yi qi / Gotta love this
Reply #22

Re: Yi qi / Gotta love this
Reply #23
Check out the comments on Ed Yong's blog here:rofl:
Quote
Ed Yong says:   
May 8, 2015 at 9:26 pm

[Okay, I've deleted everything in this thread from the point when it descends into back-and-forth gibberish. This isn't a schoolyard. - Ed]
Love is like a magic penny
 if you hold it tight you won't have any
if you give it away you'll have so many
they'll be rolling all over the floor

  • Faid
Re: Yi qi / Gotta love this
Reply #24
Check out the comments on Ed Yong's blog here:rofl:
Quote
Ed Yong says:   
May 8, 2015 at 9:26 pm

[Okay, I've deleted everything in this thread from the point when it descends into back-and-forth gibberish. This isn't Talk Rational. - Ed]
FIxed Ed's post
Who even made the rule that we cannot group ducks and fish together for the simple reason that they are both aquatic? If I want to group them that way and it serves my purpose then I can jolly well do it however I want to and it is still a nested hierarchy and you can't tell me that it's not.