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Topic: Testy Explains the Layers Which Include the Tonto Group (Read 9187 times) previous topic - next topic

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Re: Testy Explains the Layers Which Include the Tonto Group
Reply #1650
Explanation for what?

 And hold on. I thought it was YOU that was going to explain.
Ok. First, do you understand that Brown's curve or any similar curve based on any c14 concentration model at all makes testable predictions? And that those predictions are entirely independent of any actual measurements of c14 concentration in samples?
[Y]
[N]
If you want to talk about carbon-14, please find an appropriate thread for that. This thread is supposed to be about you explaining the layers which include the Tonto group.

  • VoxRat
  • wtactualf
Re: Testy Explains the Layers Which Include the Tonto Group
Reply #1651
Explanation for what?

 And hold on. I thought it was YOU that was going to explain.
Ok. First, do you understand that Brown's curve or any similar curve based on any c14 concentration model at all makes testable predictions? And that those predictions are entirely independent of any actual measurements of c14 concentration in samples?
[Y]
[N]
If you want to talk about carbon-14, please find an appropriate thread for that. This thread is supposed to be about you explaining the layers which include the Tonto group.
I'm guessing that these same layers can also be found in S. America, Africa and Eurasia ... because there was a single super continent prior to the Flood.
for fuck's sake. You are an idiot.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sedimentary_rock
"I understand Donald Trump better than many people because I really am a lot like him." - Dave Hawkins

  • Pingu
Re: Testy Explains the Layers Which Include the Tonto Group
Reply #1652
Explanation for what?

 And hold on. I thought it was YOU that was going to explain.

I'm waiting for you to say what part of my C14 radiocarbon curves post you don't understand.

When you've done that, I'll explain.

Here it is again:

Pingu ...  you are getting better about saying things more simply but this last post is still too complicated.  Try to explain it like you were explaining it to a third grader.  I don't understand why we would not expect all the curves to agree under EITHER model.  Why would that be exclusive to the OE model?

OK, Dave, that is a good question.

Let's step back a bit to where we last  had an agreement:

  • changes in atmospheric C14:C12 ratio will affect ALL samples from any given date EQUALLY.
  • Errors in count-date, because they arise from many different kinds of errors, will be DIFFERENT for different sources.


And let's first consider samples where the count-date is <5000 years old.

Let us imagine we have a set of samples for which we have both count date and radiocarbon date (calculated using N0=modern values).  This is what we would see if there were NO errors in the count date, and ALL the deviation from the 1:1 line are due to atmospheric C14:C12 ratios being different in the past:



The ORANGE datapoints are what we would see if Brown's model is correct. The BLACK data points are what we would see if N0 has been constant for the past 5000 years.  The BLUE datapoints are what we would see if something else had been the case, for instance if N0 was slightly higher in the past.

And if we kept taking more and more samples, always correctly identifying annual layers and never miscounting them or misidentifying them, we'd get more and more data points, and they would all agree:



If Brown was right, they'd all lie on Brown's line; if the "N0=constant" was right, they'd all lie on the 1:1 line; and if something else was right, they'd all lie on that line.

The AGREEMENT between the curves would tell you that the count was accurate, and the CURVE itself would tell you how much atmospheric C14:C12 ratios have changed, and by how much, over the past 5,000 years.

Am I making sense so far?

Dave, can you tell me whether this post addresses your query?  If it does, shall we move on?  If it does not, can you tell me which part you don't understand?
I have a Darwin-debased mind.

  • Faid
Re: Testy Explains the Layers Which Include the Tonto Group
Reply #1653
Explanation for what?

 And hold on. I thought it was YOU that was going to explain.
Ok. First, do you understand that Brown's curve or any similar curve based on any c14 concentration model at all makes testable predictions? And that those predictions are entirely independent of any actual measurements of c14 concentration in samples?
[Y]
[N]
If you want to talk about carbon-14, please find an appropriate thread for that. This thread is supposed to be about you explaining the layers which include the Tonto group.
Notice dave's weasely choice of words. "Find an appropriate thread". Not "talk about it in the C14 thread".

The carbon-14 thread has ceased to exist for him. It's amazing.

Of course, his sudden cognitive/memory impairment is understandable. Saying "you can discuss the matter in the C-14 thread, not here" would carry the implied weight of him supposedly responding to Testy in that thread at some point. He might claim otherwise ("well technically, I didn't say I'd respond there")- but it would still make him look like an ass, and he knows it.

So it's best, in his mind, to pretend he has forgotten all about the thread where c-14 was discussed, and tell PinguTesty to "go find" one.

Poor dave.
  • Last Edit: October 13, 2017, 06:38:08 AM by Faid
Who even made the rule that we cannot group ducks and fish together for the simple reason that they are both aquatic? If I want to group them that way and it serves my purpose then I can jolly well do it however I want to and it is still a nested hierarchy and you can't tell me that it's not.

Re: Testy Explains the Layers Which Include the Tonto Group
Reply #1654
 Again, if you want to talk about carbon-14, please use the appropriate thread. This thread is supposed to be about sedimentary rock layers which are  continent  sized, and extraordinarily thin and extraordinarily flat.

Which of course begs an explanation which is not readily apparent.

  • VoxRat
  • wtactualf
Re: Testy Explains the Layers Which Include the Tonto Group
Reply #1655
This thread is supposed to be about sedimentary rock layers which are  continent  sized, and extraordinarily thin and extraordinarily flat.
I haven't seen any evidence of any "continent sized" sedimentary rock layer.
And "extraordinarily" is meaningless if there's no baseline for "ordinary".

As far as I can tell, then, this thread is about something that exists only in your fantasy.

Quote
Which of course begs an explanation which is not readily apparent.
Which is as it should be.
Why should there be a "readily apparent explanation" for a THING that is not readily apparent?  :dunno:
  • Last Edit: October 13, 2017, 07:51:26 AM by VoxRat
"I understand Donald Trump better than many people because I really am a lot like him." - Dave Hawkins

Re: Testy Explains the Layers Which Include the Tonto Group
Reply #1656
Explanation for what?

 And hold on. I thought it was YOU that was going to explain.
Ok. First, do you understand that Brown's curve or any similar curve based on any c14 concentration model at all makes testable predictions? And that those predictions are entirely independent of any actual measurements of c14 concentration in samples?
[Y]
[N]
If you want to talk about carbon-14, please find an appropriate thread for that. This thread is supposed to be about you explaining the layers which include the Tonto group.
I said I'd explain to you after you went through your logic explaining how pingu was wrong. You didn't so I decided to take over. Anyway, I did link you to wikipedia which would have given you enough to figure out what was stupid about your billions of dead things dumbass point.
Love is like a magic penny
 if you hold it tight you won't have any
if you give it away you'll have so many
they'll be rolling all over the floor

Re: Testy Explains the Layers Which Include the Tonto Group
Reply #1657
Again, if you want to talk about carbon-14, please use the appropriate thread. This thread is supposed to be about sedimentary rock layers which are  continent  sized, and extraordinarily thin and extraordinarily flat.

Which of course begs an explanation which is not readily apparent.
With the exceptions of being continent sized, extraordinarily thin and extraordinarily flat, you got the part about sedimentary rock right!
Love is like a magic penny
 if you hold it tight you won't have any
if you give it away you'll have so many
they'll be rolling all over the floor

  • RAFH
  • Have a life, already.
Re: Testy Explains the Layers Which Include the Tonto Group
Reply #1658
Again, if you want to talk about carbon-14, please use the appropriate thread. This thread is supposed to be about sedimentary rock layers which are  continent  sized, and extraordinarily thin and extraordinarily flat.

Which of course begs an explanation which is not readily apparent.
No explanation is begged or needed if there are no continent sized and extraordinarily thin and extraordinarily flat layers of sedimentary rock. 
Which whatever you've presented in support of that claim has been convincingly refuted to no rebuttal by you.
Are we there yet?

  • RAFH
  • Have a life, already.
Re: Testy Explains the Layers Which Include the Tonto Group
Reply #1659
Again, if you want to talk about carbon-14, please use the appropriate thread. This thread is supposed to be about sedimentary rock layers which are  continent  sized, and extraordinarily thin and extraordinarily flat.

Which of course begs an explanation which is not readily apparent.
No explanation is begged or needed if there are no continent sized and extraordinarily thin and extraordinarily flat layers of sedimentary rock. 
Which whatever you've presented in support of that claim has been convincingly refuted to no rebuttal by you.
Going beyond the above, you've yet to present any evidence that a violent global storm lasting 40 days and coincident with massive tectonic events would result in such continent sized, extraordinarily thin and flat layers of sedimentary rock. Nor that such conditions occurred 5000 to 10,000 years ago or, for that matter, ever.
Are we there yet?

Re: Testy Explains the Layers Which Include the Tonto Group
Reply #1660
OK so I have to do some work proving to you the extent and characteristics of this continent sized sandstone layer ...

  • JonF
Re: Testy Explains the Layers Which Include the Tonto Group
Reply #1661
You said that some time ago. That's when you came up with the secondhand "Ager went all hoopy about it".

Not very convincing You'll have to do much better than that.
"I would never consider my evaluation of his work to be fair minded unless I had actually read his own words." - Dave Hawkins

Re: Testy Explains the Layers Which Include the Tonto Group
Reply #1662
OK so I have to do some work proving to you the extent and characteristics of this continent sized sandstone layer ...
not a whole lot. Quite a bit of it is already known and is entirely consistent with the standard model. You are a fucking idiot. I asked you the question in the c14 thread. Are you going to engage there?
Love is like a magic penny
 if you hold it tight you won't have any
if you give it away you'll have so many
they'll be rolling all over the floor

  • VoxRat
  • wtactualf
Re: Testy Explains the Layers Which Include the Tonto Group
Reply #1663
OK so I have to do some work proving to you the extent and characteristics of this continent sized sandstone layer ...
...

There's that tell again.
"I understand Donald Trump better than many people because I really am a lot like him." - Dave Hawkins

Re: Testy Explains the Layers Which Include the Tonto Group
Reply #1664
Anyone ever played poker with Hawkins? Seems like pretty easy money.

Re: Testy Explains the Layers Which Include the Tonto Group
Reply #1665
Or I guess it would be if he ever paid on his bets.

Re: Testy Explains the Layers Which Include the Tonto Group
Reply #1666
OK so I have to do some work proving to you the extent and characteristics of this continent sized sandstone layer ...

AFDave's Second Law: One may escape intellectual responsibility on any issue merely by stating an intent to pursue it.

Re: Testy Explains the Layers Which Include the Tonto Group
Reply #1667
OK so I have to do some work proving to you the extent and characteristics of this continent sized sandstone layer ...
not a whole lot. Quite a bit of it is already known and is entirely consistent with the standard model.
Hahahahaha

Sure it is.

Can you (a) describe it in detail? (b) tell how it's consistent with the "standard model"?

No, you can't.  You're bluffing again.

Re: Testy Explains the Layers Which Include the Tonto Group
Reply #1668
OK so I have to do some work proving to you the extent and characteristics of this continent sized sandstone layer ...
not a whole lot. Quite a bit of it is already known and is entirely consistent with the standard model.
Hahahahaha

Sure it is.

Can you (a) describe it in detail? (b) tell how it's consistent with the "standard model"?

No, you can't.  You're bluffing again.


Can you describe how a global fludd is consistent with C14 data?

No you cannot.

  • Martin.au
  • Thingyologist
Re: Testy Explains the Layers Which Include the Tonto Group
Reply #1669
OK so I have to do some work proving to you the extent and characteristics of this continent sized sandstone layer ...
not a whole lot. Quite a bit of it is already known and is entirely consistent with the standard model.
Hahahahaha

Sure it is.

Can you (a) describe it in detail? (b) tell how it's consistent with the "standard model"?

No, you can't.  You're bluffing again.


Describe what in detail Dave?

And yeah, of course it (assuming "it" is Dave's rather vague specification of large sedimentary layers) is consistent with the standard model. Where do you think the standard model came from.
"That which can be asserted with evidence can also be dismissed without evidence." (Dave Hawkins)

Re: Testy Explains the Layers Which Include the Tonto Group
Reply #1670
"describe what in detail?"

Lol

The cheese that the moon is made of.

  • Martin.au
  • Thingyologist
Re: Testy Explains the Layers Which Include the Tonto Group
Reply #1671
"describe what in detail?"

Lol

The cheese that the moon is made of.

Which "continent sized sandstone layer" are you hoping to prove the extent of? Time period? Anything?

Or just your second law in action?
"That which can be asserted with evidence can also be dismissed without evidence." (Dave Hawkins)

  • VoxRat
  • wtactualf
Re: Testy Explains the Layers Which Include the Tonto Group
Reply #1672
"describe what in detail?"

Lol

The cheese that the moon is made of.
It would help if you would read other people's posts once in a while.
Not just scan them for where you think you can score "gotcha!"s. 
This thread is supposed to be about sedimentary rock layers which are  continent  sized, and extraordinarily thin and extraordinarily flat.
I haven't seen any evidence of any "continent sized" sedimentary rock layer.
And "extraordinarily" is meaningless if there's no baseline for "ordinary".

As far as I can tell, then, this thread is about something that exists only in your fantasy.

Quote
Which of course begs an explanation which is not readily apparent.
Which is as it should be.
Why should there be a "readily apparent explanation" for a THING that is not readily apparent?  :dunno:
The only one obviously BLUFFING here is you, Hawkins.
As usual.
And, as usual, that bluff having been called, you're now into the content-free bluster and bravado phase.
Just. Like. Clockwork.
"I understand Donald Trump better than many people because I really am a lot like him." - Dave Hawkins

Re: Testy Explains the Layers Which Include the Tonto Group
Reply #1673
OK so I have to do some work proving to you the extent and characteristics of this continent sized sandstone layer ...
not a whole lot. Quite a bit of it is already known and is entirely consistent with the standard model.
Hahahahaha

Sure it is.

Can you (a) describe it in detail? (b) tell how it's consistent with the "standard model"?

No, you can't.  You're bluffing again.

C14 thread first.

Eta: also, as this thread has made everyone but you aware, the explanation involving advancing and receding  seas is exactly consistent with the data. Find a single counter example. That would, or course, require you figure out the actual claims by actual geologists and we know that's not happening here.

Anyway, c14.
  • Last Edit: October 14, 2017, 09:57:16 AM by Testy Calibrate
Love is like a magic penny
 if you hold it tight you won't have any
if you give it away you'll have so many
they'll be rolling all over the floor

Re: Testy Explains the Layers Which Include the Tonto Group
Reply #1674
"describe what in detail?"

Lol

The cheese that the moon is made of.

Which "continent sized sandstone layer" are you hoping to prove the extent of? Time period? Anything?

Or just your second law in action?
The one which is called "Tapeats" in the area of the Grand Canyon.  It's called Tintic Quartzite in central Utah,  in northeastern Utah it is the Lodore Quartzite; in Wyoming and Montana it is the Flathead Sandstone; in Colorado it is the Sawatch Sandstone; in South Dakota it is the Deadwood Quartzite; in the Midwest it is the St. Simon Sandstone; in the Ozarks it is the Lamotte Sandstone; and in northern New York state it is the Potsdam Sandstone.

That one.

Stop playing dumb.